bootc and OSTree are both very neat, but the leading edge of immutable Linux distros (GNOME OS, KDE Linux) is currently converging on a different proposal by systemd developers that's standardized by the UAPI Group (https://uapi-group.org/specifications/). It fixes quite a few of the complexities with OSTree (updates are handled by `systemd-sysupdate`/`updatectl` and are just files served via HTTP) and is quite a bit easier to extend with things like an immutable version of the Nvidia drivers or codecs thanks to system extensions handled by `systemd-sysext` (which in turn are just simple squashfs files overlayed over `/usr`) and configuration via `systemd-confext`. `mkosi`, also by systemd, is quickly becoming _the_ way to build custom images too, and is somewhat tied to these new standards.

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lproven 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> bootc and OSTree are both very neat

May I rephrase that?

bootc and OStree are both Cthulhoid nightmare horrors that only exist because of corporate politics, but the leading edge...

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rurban 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Typo: (CoreOS and Fedora Silverblue) are the bleeding edge of immutable distros. Those mentioned are just users.

	▲	pojntfx 3 hours ago \| parent [-]
		GNOME OS uses BuildStream and as a result has no concept of packages at all and no relationship to any distro, KDE Linux is based on Arch. There is no relationship between the two. GNOME OS used to be OSTree based but switched to systemd-sysupdate a while ago.

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smashed 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> the bleeding edge of immutable Linux distros (GNOME OS, KDE Linux)

These are words but they don't make sense.

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pojntfx 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Corrected - I meant leading edge.

Context re:distros mentioned:

GNOME OS: https://os.gnome.org/ KDE Linux: https://kde.org/linux/

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n42 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

"some of the newer ideas happening in this space are in the GNOME OS project and the KDE Linux project"

	▲	hparadiz 3 hours ago \| parent [-]
		My Gentoo box is immutable. Right up until I run emerge.

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znpy 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

From https://uapi-group.org/ :

> Contributing members include people from Ubuntu Core, Debian, GNOME OS, Fedora CoreOS, Endless OS, Arch Linux, SUSE, Flatcar, systemd, image-builder/osbuild, mkosi, tpm2-software, System Transparency, buildstream, BTRFS, bootc, composefs, (rpm-)ostree, Microsoft, Amazon, and Meta.

Note systemd, (rpm-)ostree and bootc.

My understanding is that uapi is another initiative but not completely separated from bootc and ostree. Maybe complementary.

	▲	pojntfx 3 hours ago \| parent [-]
		Sorry, not completely separate, yes, but some of the parts of the standard (e.g. systemd-sysext for layering "packages") and closely related things like systemd-sysupdate do actually replace parts of this (esp. ostree).