| ▲ | 9cb14c1ec0 9 hours ago |
| There is not a single OpenAI model in the top 10 on openrouter's ranking page. The market is saying something about the comparative value of OpenAI. Edit: yes, it is true that many people do integrate directly with OpenAI. That doesn't negate the fact that Openrouter users are largely not using OpenAI. |
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| ▲ | runako 7 hours ago | parent | next [-] |
| Methodology problems aside, do we have any idea how big OpenRouter is as compared to the big providers? OpenRouter claims "5M+" users; OpenAI is claiming >900M weekly active users. I don't really think it's possible to learn anything about the broader market by looking at the OpenRouter model rankings. |
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| ▲ | progbits 4 hours ago | parent [-] | | Agreed it's not really good signal (many sampling biases) but user count is not relevant, most money is from heavy API users. 900M users with free or cheap subscription are nothing compared to even 10k heavy API users. On the other hand, big users don't use openrouter. At $work we have our own routing logic. |
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| ▲ | runeblaze 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| 1. openrouter is API usage. There is obviously consumer side 2. people often use openrouter for the sole purpose of using a unified chat completions API 3. OpenAI invented chat completions; if you use openrouter for chat completions often you can just switch your endpoint URL to point to the OAI endpoint to avoid the openrouter surcharge! 4. Hence anyone with large enough volume will very likely not use openrouter for OpenAI; there is an active incentive to take the easy route of changing the endpoint URL to OAI’s |
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| ▲ | spott 9 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| This could just be because everyone is using direct OpenAI api keys when using OpenAI. |
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| ▲ | cj 9 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| > The market is saying something about the comparative value of OpenAI. Is it? At what point are the models going to all be "good enough", with the differentiating factor being everything else, other than model ranking? That day will come. Not everyone needs a Ferrari. Edit: I misread the parent, I think they're saying the same thing. |
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| ▲ | nradov 9 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Model rankings are irrelevant. No one cares. The differentiating factor will be access to proprietary training data. Everyone can scrape the public web and use that to train an LLM. The frontier companies are spending a fortune to buy exclusive licenses to private data sources, and even hiring expert humans specifically to create new training data on priority topics. | | | |
| ▲ | alephnerd 9 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | > At what point are the models going to all be "good enough", with the differentiating factor being everything else, other than model ranking? It's already come for vast swathes of industries. Most organizations have already been able to operationalize what are essentially GPT4 and GPT5 wrappers for standard enterprise usecases such as network security (eg. Horizon3) and internal knowledge discovery and synthesis (eg. GleanAI back in 2024-25). | | |
| ▲ | 9cb14c1ec0 9 hours ago | parent [-] | | Yes, and that is why I used the phrase comparative value. The concept of winning business based on being #1 on the benchmarks is dead. | | |
| ▲ | alephnerd 9 hours ago | parent [-] | | I agree, and most of my peers do as well. This is why most of us shifted to funding AI Applications startups back in 2023-24. Most of these players are still in stealth or aren't household names, but neither are ServiceNow, Salesforce, Palo Alto Networks, Wiz, or Snowflake. Foundation Models have reached a relative plateau and much of the recent hype wasn't due to enhanced model performance but smart packaging on top of existing capabilities to solve business outcomes (eg. OpenClaw, Antheopic's business suite, etc). Most foundation model rounds are essentially growth equity rounds (not venture capital) to finance infra/DC buildouts to scale out delivery or custom ASICs to enhance operating margins. This isn't a bad thing - it means AI in the colloquial definition has matured to the point that it has become reality. |
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| ▲ | poplarsol 9 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Or, their customers integrate with them directly. |
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| ▲ | 9 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| [deleted] |
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| ▲ | esafak 9 hours ago | parent | prev [-] |
| Sample bias. |
