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epistasis 3 hours ago

> they don’t even think we should be allowed to argue for more housing. They don’t think we are even entitled to a fair hearing. We should all recognize that silencing your political rivals is beyond the pale and that complaints like this one, even if they end up going nowhere, can have a chilling effect on activists and ordinary people who want to exercise their rights.

Don't worry, there are sooo many free speech absolutists that will come out of the woodwork to protect this dastardly attempt to stifle speech through abuse of legal procedures.

No? Where did all those absolutists go?

bhupy 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

This comment is a hilarious example of: https://x.com/AustingrahamZ1/status/1029385497213366279?lang...

epistasis 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

For this to be anything like "so you hate waffles" there would have to somebody going around declaring to all that "all breakfast foods are good and can not be criticized" and them only showing up to defend pancakes on the basis of "all breakfast foods" but then deafening silence when waffles or bacon or scrambled eggs get trampled on in a far more prevalant manner.

Even the one reply to me from a self-proclaimed absolutist didn't bother to defend the political speech and petition of government, just said that they were present!

relaxing 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

No, this is not the phenomenon that post is referring to.

watwut 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

No, your comment is an example of "argument by joke" and "false equivalency".

The bad faith free speech argument that somehow applies to only some people, to only one side of the political divide, but never to the other was prevalent mainstream argument for years now. Some peoples free speech was sacred and if you criticized or opposed them, the criticism and opposition themselves did not counted as free speech - even if it in fact consisted of speech only.

So like, kicking at those people is entirely fair. Because they actively damaged "free speech". Not that they care or ever cared.

joe_mamba 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

THat's basically my activity on HN. 10% arguing why I like pancakes, and 90% replying to the stream of people accusing me of hating waffles.

anonymars 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Flashbacks... https://dilbert-viewer.herokuapp.com/2001-11-05

metalliqaz 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Yeah but waffles have been historically excluded from the breakfast table. /s

dlcarrier 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

My theory is that the major parties are currently going through another swap of ideals, so the free-speech absolutists don't have a home.

The regions that give the strongest support to the Democrats, like Marin County in California, don't want anything built, are actively kicking out ranchers that have lived there for generations, are adamantly against anyone calling anyone else something offensive, and are in general against what was classically liberal.

Meanwhile, rural Texas counties that give the strongest support to the Republicans are for worker protections, generally against government-prohibitions on insulting someone, are increasing in their support for populism, and so on.

The Democrats used to support free-speech absolutists, who are no longer welcome there, but the Republicans are just opening up to the ideal, and don't fully support it yet.

2 hours ago | parent | next [-]
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iamnothere 41 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

I am not even sure it’s a swap. I see a lot of RW sentiment lately that libertarian principles are self-defeating, and the only thing that matters is Straussian friend-enemy distinction.

Basically, the extreme wings of both parties are seizing power and preparing for battle, while the moderate wings are tuning out. (Or to put it another way, more of the center is becoming politically independent.)

Traditional ideological lines break down under these conditions, because the important thing is damaging your enemies, not maintaining ideological consistency.

fnordpiglet 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

They were sued by the current administration and recorded as domestic terrorists,held down and sprayed in the face by irregular paramilitary with extrajudicial powers, detained without probable cause or charges, investigated by the FBI in the dead of night, placed on no fly lists, post retirement rank demoted, fired, laid off, swatted, delivered pizza in the name of dead relatives, and all the wonderful stuff that’s making America great again.

zahlman an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Please speak plainly. It comes across like you allege that "free speech absolutists" would betray their principles due to aligning with NIMBYs (I read "protect" as "protect against", because otherwise it makes even less sense). But where on Earth does that assumption come from? If your intent is not to sneer at a political outgroup (based on a prediction, not even actual conduct) when why adopt this tone?

slibhb 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Hi I'm right here

epistasis 2 hours ago | parent [-]

Nice! Any thoughts on this matter, as in does it get you outraged as a free speech absolutist?

2 hours ago | parent [-]
[deleted]
iamnothere 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Free speech should obviously be protected in all circumstances including this one. I don’t know what you are going on about, but it’s probably the unfortunately common and flawed perception that anyone who supports “free speech” right now is an unprincipled right winger who only supports it for their ideological allies.

zahlman an hour ago | parent [-]

Which strikes me as bizarre, first because it requires that fallacious assumption and secondly because it requires mapping NIMBY onto the right wing. Which arguably tracks with what one would naturally expect from free-associating words like "conservative", but the evidence doesn't show me any strong correlations except possibly in the opposite direction (considering the evidence of new housing starts vs. local voting patterns).

paulddraper 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I like free speech.

I also oppose mandatory licensing. (In this case, to practice law)

The latter is the accusation, it seems impossible it’s not thrown out.

2 hours ago | parent [-]
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3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]
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bpt3 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

[flagged]