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jll29 3 hours ago

> The only time when you need something else than Agile is when lives are at stake, you need there formal specifications and rigorous testing.

Lives are always at stake, given that we use software everywhere, and often in unintended ways, even outside its spec (isn't that a definition of a "hack"?).

People think of medical appliance software, space/air traffic software, defense systems or real-time embedded systems as the only environments where "lives are stake", but actually, in subtle ways, a violation of user expectancy (in some software companies, UX issues count as serious bugs) in a Word processor, Web browser or the sort command can kill a human.

Two real-life examples:

(1) a few years ago, a Chinese factory worker was killed by a robot. It was not in the spec that a human could ever walk in the robot's path (the first attested example of "AI" killing a human that I found at the time). This was way before deep larning entered the stage, and the factory was a closed and fully automated environment.

(2) Also a few years back, the Dutch software for social benefits management screwed up, and thousands of families just did not get pay out any money at all for an extended period. Allegedly, this led to starvations (I don't have details - but if any Dutch read this, please share), and eventually a whole Dutch government was forced to resign over the scandal.

agentultra 36 minutes ago | parent [-]

That's a very narrow definition of engineering. What about property? Sensitive information?

It's a fine "whoopsie-doodle," when your software erases the life savings of a few thousand people. "We'll fix that in the next release," is already too little, too late.