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| ▲ | kajecounterhack 8 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | It has utility though: unlike the dollars in your mattress, it can't be printed into oblivion by your central bank. It is relatively portable, and people have flocked to it as a store of value especially during periods of socioeconomic instability when assets are going down and gov't spending is going up. It's tradeable for fiat in any country, so it allows you to bring value along if you relocate. Its price reflects that utility and like any modern asset, a lot of speculation. You can speculate on whether it's more or less useful given current events -- nothing wrong with speculating that it is only going to be increasingly useful. | | |
| ▲ | mapontosevenths 7 hours ago | parent [-] | | You're right that it has utility, but being fungible doesnt imply that it is automatically an investment. Speculation is not the same as investment, and it is still completely non-productive. | | |
| ▲ | kajecounterhack 7 hours ago | parent [-] | | Agree it doesn't generate wealth. It's explicitly a store of wealth. Investment is a weird term because most people would consider keeping cash or cash equivalents (gold) to be investments, even if they don't generate wealth. Cash is also an opinion, in terms of the market. | | |
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| ▲ | its_ethan 7 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | What is it that you're arguing for then? That there be some entity that gets to decide what is and isn't a productive use of all of our excess money? Who gets to decide what's excess? Who gets to decide what is and isn't a productive use of the money? How is this any different than buying a house? Buying a house that's already been built is pretty damn close to the same thing as buying gold. No new "work" is being done into the economy, you're just exchanging dollars for an asset that will likely appreciate a bit faster than inflation but less than $SPY. The person you bought it from can do something else with that money, sure, but that's also true of the other person in your transaction to buy gold. Maybe you'll say a house has more utility than bars of gold, but all of this at the end of the day, seems to come down to your specific views and judgements of what it means for capital to be used productively. So to circle back to the beginning, what is it you're advocating for here? That because you don't see gold as a low risk hedge against inflation as being "productive" it should face more taxes to incentivize it not happening? | | |
| ▲ | freedomben 7 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | > Buying a house that's already been built is pretty damn close to the same thing as buying gold. No new "work" is being done into the economy, you're just exchanging dollars for an asset that will likely appreciate a bit faster than inflation but less than $SPY. I mostly agree with you, but I don't think the house comparison is good. Houses require lots of maintenance, and to hold their value (comparable to other houses) they often need remodeling every decade or so. If instead of houses we just said "land" then I think the comparison would hold up more. | |
| ▲ | mapontosevenths 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | No, im not arguing that it should be illegal. Im just saying, as Warren Buffet before me did, that its not an investment. It relies on the greater fool theory to produce excess returns. It is bad for the economy when money idles in non productive speculative assets. | | |
| ▲ | amanaplanacanal 7 hours ago | parent [-] | | The money didn't disappear, it just changed hands. | | |
| ▲ | mapontosevenths 6 hours ago | parent [-] | | You are forgetting the opportunity cost. The gold does not generate wealth it just stores value, like a mattress stuffed with bills. It has become a dead, stagnant, and unproductive thing and by doing that it has removed value from the overall economy that was previously there. | | |
| ▲ | amanaplanacanal 4 hours ago | parent [-] | | How? The money that was used to buy it is now in the hands of somebody else that can invest it. Nothing was lost. It just changed hands. |
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| ▲ | michaelmrose 7 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | You either maintain the house for others use and extract rent or live in it. This is productive. If you are hoarding an unused house we should heavily tax that to make it unreasonable to do so. |
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