| |
| ▲ | jorge-d 3 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | This is wrong on so many levels. The German economy profits _a lot_ from the membership.
You can't just look at the monetary in/out flows to/from EU accounts but to the system as a whole. | | |
| ▲ | 3 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | [deleted] | |
| ▲ | 8964689797595 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | [flagged] | | |
| ▲ | harperlee 3 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | For example, decades of pegging the value of the currency down, thus facilitating exports on a massive scale and thus pushing up the performance of whole industries, without other member states that would have had their currency devaluated being able to compete on prize. | |
| ▲ | pegasus 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | They probably didn't list any because estimating the upsides versus the downsides is what it's about, and that's very hard to quantify. Suggesting, like you seem to, that there are no upsides to the German economy whatsoever, is just not a serious argument so doesn't actually deserve a serious answer. | |
| ▲ | LunaSea 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Tariffs on Chinese EV cars that would obliterate the German automotive industry and economy? |
|
| |
| ▲ | pegasus 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | That sounds an awful lot like the Trump whining about being taking advantage of while bullying countries around the world to do his bidding. | |
| ▲ | cael450 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | This is the same argument Trump is using to blow up America's position in NATO. |
|
| |
| ▲ | miroljub 4 hours ago | parent [-] | | Just because you accusse people to be "right wingers" because they don't want to fund bicycle lanes in foreign countries doesn't make them wrong. If you want to fund bicycle lanes in foreign countries, go start a fund an fund them privately. For the people that don't know the topic: - yes, German taxpayers are indeed funding bicycle lanes in foreign countries - it's not the only waste of money going to foreign countries And additional questions: - since when is it forbidden to complain against the waste of tax money? - how does favouring tax cuts instead of tax money waste makes you a "right wing"? | | |
| ▲ | tchalla an hour ago | parent | next [-] | | >> For the people that don't know the topic: >> - yes, German taxpayers are indeed funding bicycle lanes in foreign countries Just for people to know this, we are talking about 44Mn€ (20Mn€ + 24Mn€) of money in Peru as the commentator mentions below. It is wasteful but it has practically no effect on Germany. There are 1000x things that Germany does within Germany that moves the needle more than the talking about this rounding error. But that requires introspection and ownership of responsibility - both alien to the country’s normal compliance attitude of working. | |
| ▲ | lifty 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | I agree with your characterisation of what is going on, and at some point, the EU states will have to decide for full fiscal integration or for removing the common currency. You can't have a common currency without a common fiscal union. So we either have to integrate more or desintegrate more, this inbetween we have now is not working very well. Speaking as a European, not sure what is better. | | |
| ▲ | miroljub 3 hours ago | parent [-] | | Not related to the comment, but in general I agree with you. You can't have a single monetary system without complete unification, including tax systems, budgeting systems, governance models, retirement systems, benefits. I mean, you can, like we have now, but it's not sustainable, and eventually we all have it worse. As a European, I would not want to go that way, since I'm afraid such a unified EU will be a bureaucratic monster that is even more centralized than the USA, and way more autocratic than any current EU state. I'd rather take a step back, dissolve much of the EU's competences, and go back to pure trade union, dissolve the EURO as a currency, and let every member state take sovereign decisions on their own. |
| |
| ▲ | harperlee 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Funding other member states to be able to grow may be labeled waste, or investment on creating new markets for Germany. | | |
| ▲ | miroljub 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | That's the same fallacy as claiming that rich people save money by donating to charity. Simple example: - Germany gives 100 € to other EU states - Those states 100 € to buy made in Germany goods - German companies have 10 € profits from those sales - German state collects 5 € from those profits In summary, German taxpayers paid 100 € so the state can collect 5 € taxes, and companies another 5 €. Not a very good deal. And this calculation is crazy optimistic, because it assumes that all money that Germany gives to other countries will be used to purchase German good. In reality, they will be spent willy-nilly and German companies may not see even 1 € in return. | | |
| ▲ | ivan_gammel 7 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | | This calculation is flawed. German state collects much more than 5€, because there is VAT etc and, of course, employees of that company pay income tax from their share of that 100€ they just got back. | |
| ▲ | harperlee 34 minutes ago | parent | prev [-] | | It seems that in your worldview value and wealth does not increase, just changes hands. |
|
| |
| ▲ | sevenzero 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | What people like you dont understand is what we get back from investing into foreign countries. We dont just build bicycle lanes there because we are such nice people. | | |
| ▲ | miroljub 3 hours ago | parent [-] | | Can you please explain (ELI style) the great benefits German taxpayers have from the bicycle lanes in Peru? |
|
|
|
