| ▲ | akst 6 hours ago |
| I think a lot people underestimate how arbitrary some editorial decisions on wikipedia can be. Yeah perfect is the enemy of the good but imperfect is still imperfect. Can’t say I’m a fan of jj mccullough‘s opinions on some stuff but his video on wikipedia is good https://youtu.be/-vmSFO1Zfo8?si=0mS24EVODwLrPJ3T I don’t feel as strongly as he does but ever since watching I just don’t see much value in starting with Wikipedia when researching something. He also points out how a lot content creators default to referencing it. After realising how much of history or geography YouTube is just regurgitating Wikipedia articles, it kind of ruined those kinds of videos for me, and this was before AI. So now I try spend more time reading books or listening to audiobooks on a topics I’m interested instead. Like I still use Wikipedia for unserious stuff or checking if a book I was recommended was widely criticised or something but that’s it really. It’s also just not a good learning resource, like if you ever wanted to study a mathematics topic, wikipedia might be one of the worst resources. Like Wikipedia doesn’t profess to be a learning resource and more a overview resource but even the examples they use sometimes are just kind of unhelpful. Here’s an example on the Fourier Transform https://youtu.be/33y9FMIvcWY?si=ys8BwDu_4qa01jso |
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| ▲ | palata 4 hours ago | parent | next [-] |
| > I think a lot people underestimate how arbitrary some editorial decisions on wikipedia can be. I think it is true for all information we consume. One of the very important skills to learn in life is to think critically. Who wrote this? When? What would be their bias? Text is written by humans (or now sometimes LLMs), and humans are imperfect (and LLMs are worth what they are worth). Many times Wikipedia is more than enough, sometimes it is not. Nothing is perfect, and it is very important to understand it. |
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| ▲ | alkonaut 18 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | | Also, I think for 99% of Wikipedia, there isn't much need to worry about Biases. It's about an uncontroversial chemical compound, a tiny village, a family of bacteria and so on. Knowledge isn't all subjective and prone to bias. | |
| ▲ | akst 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | My point was mostly, people just aren’t as aware of issues with it compared to other forms of media. Issues in other forms of media don’t change that or make it less of an issue. At the end of the day you’re gonna to consume information from somewhere, it’ll have shortcomings but you’re still better off knowing that going in. On bias’ of authors: I actually think people fixate a bit too much on bias of an author to the point it’s a solely used as a speculative reason to dismiss something asuntrue. If the claims made by the author are consistent with other information and others trusted sources it’s just irrelevant. I feel people online to readily get hung up motivations and it’s sometimes a crotch for a readers inability to engage with ideas they find uncomfortable. Like if a private company sponsors a study with a finding that aligns with their business interests, that actually doesn’t mean it’s false. It’s false if no one can reproduce their results. I mean you’d definitely want to verify other sources knowing this, but also researches have their own reputation to preserve as well. In reality the truth ends up being more boring than people anticipate. But obviously it matters when claims can’t be verified or tested but I find online there’s an overemphasis of this online. | | |
| ▲ | dijit an hour ago | parent | next [-] | | I couldn't agree more with this. Small typo though: I believe you meant "crutch" not "crotch" in: > feel people online to readily get hung up motivations and it’s sometimes a crotch for a readers inability to engage with ideas they find uncomfortable. | |
| ▲ | palata 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Critical thinking does not mean that you dismiss the information. It just means that you take the potential bias into account. The media are often pretty bad at doing this: they will often make some kind of average on what is being said, like "the scientific consensus says that cigarettes are killing you, but a study sponsored by Philip Morris says that they are not, so... well we don't know". Where actually it should be pretty obvious that Philip Morris is extremely biased on that, and the scientific consensus is not. Not every voice is worth the same. During covid, there was a tendency to relay all kinds of opinions, without making the difference between actual experts and non-experts. Sometimes even saying "this person is a doctor, so they know", which is wrong: being a doctor doesn't make you an expert on coronaviruses or epidemiology. Whenever we get information, we should think about how much trust we can put into it, how biased the authors maybe (consciously or not), etc. Elon Musk saying that going to Mars can help humanity is not worth much. Because he is rich and successful does not make him right. Yet many people relay "Musk predicts that [...]", as some kind of truth. |
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| ▲ | preommr 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| I think people underestimate how arbitrary editorial decisions are for any media. Things like PBS and Wikipedia might have biases, but idk if it's realistic to expect better. |
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| ▲ | akst 3 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Idk if this how it came off but just tbc my point also wasn’t indirectly promoting traditional media. I think a lot if ppl are rightly sceptical of traditional media, but I feel I see more people giving Wikipedia a pass or placing it on a higher pedestal as a resource than it should be at times. Admittedly I think I would prefer Wikipedia to traditional media in most cases. Although that wasn’t really what I was getting at | |
| ▲ | fellowniusmonk 31 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | It's funny how the more accurate a source gets the more it draws in people desiring accuracy. Then this rather small cohort of high precision people express frustrations without providing the context of accuracy against the masses preferred methods (TikTok, cable news, broadcast, truth social) So now the water is muddled and people and Ais are mistrained because an "absolute scale" is not used when discussing accuracy. | |
| ▲ | nephihaha an hour ago | parent | prev [-] | | I very rarely watch PBS (I don't live stateside), but it is extremely biased. I lasted one and a half documentaries on the free trial. I've seen plenty of their other content elsewhere. Maybe it doesn't resonate with non-Americans. |
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| ▲ | graemep 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Reading (the right) books is definitely the best way to learn about a topic, but its not great for quickly looking up random stuff. Books can spread misinformation too, from Malleus Maleficarum to Erich von Däniken. It is useful for quickly looking up simple facts, and provides a list of sources. The video makes some interesting criticisms. The lack of diversity is not surprising. Dominated by white, male, American's with time on their hands! how would have thought that? Its very obviously American dominated (at least the English version). |
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| ▲ | kiba 4 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | I once partly cross verify a virologist's lecture. He confused a brother of an important scientist who made an important discovery. I have no doubt that he knows what he's talking about when it comes to viruses. All in all, checking other sources to see if they lines up is a pain and labor intensive, never mind actually checking to see if the references are actually sound evidence. | |
| ▲ | loloquwowndueo 5 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Spanish Wikipedia is dominated by folks from Spain, despite Spain being a minority of Spanish speakers. | | |
| ▲ | nephihaha an hour ago | parent [-] | | The Scottish Gaelic Wikipedia is dominated by a German. As was the Greenlandic one before he decided to dismantle it. |
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| ▲ | nialv7 5 hours ago | parent | prev [-] |
| > jj mccullough‘s opinions holy heck there is so much wrong about this video. i can't believe "internet influencers" can just turn on their cameras and spew so much untruth without a care in the world... comparatively wikipedia is imperfect, but much better than this kind of slop. |
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| ▲ | akst 3 hours ago | parent [-] | | Feel free to actually articulate the actual issues you’re referring to. It’s been a while since I watched it but the thing I remember taking away was you can do a lot better than Wikipedia, and he encouraged people to spend more time looking at primary sources for deeper research, and points out how it’s the basis of a lot of slop on YouTube. | | |
| ▲ | ericjmorey an hour ago | parent [-] | | Seems like he's recommending secondary sources over Wikipedia as a tertiary source. |
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