Value wise when trying to spec out my personal Lenovo laptop on framework, it'd never get anywhere close to being worth it even if I completely made use of the hardware after a future upgrade.

Framework makes sense if you're going in on the sustainability idea, but other than that it's really just an expensive laptop that's not compelling against its competitors

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arghwhat 12 hours ago | parent | next [-]

The pricing when I looked was similar. I went with a Lenovo last time because the Framework 16 hadn't quite matured, but premium anything is never going to make financial sense.

Buying and repairing a framework is never going to be cheaper than going through consumable trash laptops, and buying top of the line laptops and trying to use them longer is never going to be cheaper or better than buying medium grade laptops and upgrading more often.

What you're paying for right now is the customization capabilities and the ideology. Upgrading and customizing a single platform with a community, vs. a fixed one-off design that'll be lost next time you upgrade.

If Framework isn't already compelling to you at this time, then you're not the target audience. They might drop in price, but they'll never win a race to the bottom.

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casenmgreen 14 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

I can swap out my mobo for a RISC-V mobo, or ARM.

Get away from Intel and management engine.

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kec 12 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Or you could just buy a MacBook Air for like $900 (or one of the windows snapdragon machines, but it you care about avoiding Intel I’m assuming you want Linux and doubt the support is as good as asahi on Macs)

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E39M5S62 12 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Snapdragon support is decent to great these days, and importantly it's all in the mainline kernel tree.

Edit: though it should be said that what I think is good might be a far cry from you think is good. I did use a Thinkpad X13s as my primary work machine for 6 months, though.

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Pet_Ant 12 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I mean, this could literally be the last laptop shell, screen, keyboard and power adapter you ever buy. That's a fantastic sustainability story. Not to mention that if it dies you are never at risk of having to replace the whole thing unless it melts in a fire.

	▲	kec 10 hours ago \| parent \| next [-]
		It could be… but it won’t be. Internals will be outmoded quickly, and I would be shocked if logic boards from ~5 years from now will still be compatible just as needs evolve (especially around cooling and power delivery)… and this is all before physical wear and tear on screen/keyboard/ports. I would be very surprised if many frameworks are upgraded ship of Theseus style for decades, or if the total cost of ownership (and even ecological impact, most of the nastiness is going to be the electronic internals, not the metal casing) is lower than for someone buying a more integrated laptop ever 5-6 years.
	▲	ericd 9 hours ago \| parent \| prev [-]
		In the context of the massive amount of throwaway packaging involved in the food supply chain, or every other part of the supply chain for every consumable we use, how big a deal is that? Are electronics uniquely impactful in terms of sustainability versus eg plastic clamshells to transport apples?

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tstrimple 11 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Literally just picked up a 13" M4 Air for $750 from Best Buy for my wife. It was spend $500 to replace her older MBA screen or a bit extra for a whole new device.

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contingencies 12 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Macbook air = small keyboard, small screen, limited battery, all parts expensive to service, etc. Try hacking a Mac Mini instead: https://github.com/vk2diy/hackbook-m4-mini

	▲	rogerrogerr 11 hours ago \| parent \| next [-]
		A MacBook Air is just a Mac mini with a keyboard, screen, and battery. You can choose to attach the same peripherals to your MacBook, and have the flexibility of a laptop when you need it. Paying a couple hundred dollar premium for this is a good deal.
	▲	giantrobot 6 hours ago \| parent \| prev [-]
		The MacBook Air has a standard size keyboard.

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adolph 12 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> I can swap out my mobo for a RISC-V mobo, or ARM.

You can't do that with the 16, only the 13 [0] and you can't upgrade ram on it. Which is kind of the problem in a nutshell. Over time fewer user modifications make sense due to the context of the whole computer as an integrated system.

0. https://frame.work/products/deep-computing-risc-v-mainboard

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_zoltan_ 9 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

nobody ever does. maybe 2 people on the planet...

for everybody else, a Mac is perfect ;-)

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12 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

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