It's fine for them to make suggestions for projects to improve their software. The problem is threatening clients with being banned because they don't agree with those suggestions. If a website is able to ban me because of the passkey client I'm using, then I'm just not going to use passkeys. It's too unreliable.

> personally think the ability to export+import passkeys is a good thing from a backup point of view

It's not a "good thing," it's absolutely critical. If I can't back up my credentials in a location that I trust, then it's not an acceptable login method. What happens if my PC goes down and I couldn't export my data? I just can't log in anywhere? KeePassXC lets me do that, but the spec authors think it's appropriate to ban me for using it because it lets me manage my own data. That's bonkers.

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jeroenhd 3 hours ago | parent [-]

I don't see where he is threatening anybody? He's just stating the obvious. If you promise to store a key in a non-exportable format and then create a big export button, websites won't trust your software.

> What happens if my PC goes down and I couldn't export my data? I just can't log in anywhere?

Then you follow the procedure you would follow for when you'd forget your password. Probably a password reset through email, maybe calling customer support. Or if you have it set up, you could use the passkey set up on your phone or Yubikey or whatever to log in and create a new password on your new PC.

Passkeys aren't passwords, that's the whole point. It's modelled after the "something you have" factor, not "something you know". If you're finding workarounds to violate the security design, you're not gaining any advantage by using passkeys. Just use a password if you want to use a password.

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coldpie 3 hours ago | parent [-]

> If you're finding workarounds to violate the security design, you're not gaining any advantage by using passkeys.

The trouble is, if websites are allowed/encouraged to ban clients, then the advantages you're talking about come with the downside of hard-tying yourself to one of 3 US-based Big Tech companies, because those will be the only ones who will ship clients declared "secure." That's not a trade-off I'm willing to make for something as critical as my service logins. You can already see this happening, almost every article talking about passkeys assumes you're logging in with an Apple, Google, or Microsoft device.

> Then you follow the procedure you would follow for when you'd forget your password. Probably a password reset through email, maybe calling customer support.

This is a downgrade from passwords (and exportable passkeys), where I can just restore it from a backup.

> Just use a password if you want to use a password.

Yeah, that's what I plan to keep doing, unfortunately. What I'm worried about is a password-less future where that's no longer an option and we all have to submit to using one of Android, iOS, or Windows to log in to everything because those are the only clients that can be trusted(TM) to handle the user's data as the big tech companies and governments desire it to be handled. This is a dark future.

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an hour ago | parent | next [-]

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Magnusmaster 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

You already need to submit to iOS or stock Android for a myriad of banking or government apps that use remote attestation to verify that you are running "untampered" software.

Remote attestation is evil.

	▲	coldpie 2 hours ago \| parent [-]
		FWIW this has not been my experience in the US, I've always been able to use websites for these things. I use my phone for almost nothing important since I don't trust it. But yes, I fear we are heading in that direction too.