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JumpCrisscross 8 hours ago

> Come the next Big One earthquake, all of San Francisco’s emergency services will be blocked by Waymos

Were any emergency vehicles actually blocked?

We have an actual failure here–step one is identifying actual failures so we can distinguish what really happened from what hypothetically could.

MBCook 8 hours ago | parent | next [-]

I don’t know. But if human drivers are having to go around them, they’re not doing the right thing.

They need to drive or pull over. Never just stop there in the road and wait.

JumpCrisscross 8 hours ago | parent [-]

> if human drivers are having to go around them, they’re not doing the right thing

They're not. But it's also not a disaster. Pretending it is on Twitter is pandering, not policymaking.

> They need to drive or pull over. Never just stop there in the road and wait

Agreed. Waymo has a lesson to learn from. Sacramento, and the NHTSA, similarly, need to draw up emergency minimums for self-driving cars.

There are productive responses to this episode. None of them involve flipping out on X.

jazzyjackson 5 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> Waymo has a lesson to learn from.

At what point can we be spared from having Waymos lessons inflicted upon us

SR2Z 19 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

In this country, if heart disease or cancer doesn't kill you, a car probably did.

Until "Waymos lessons" are killing people at that rate, I am 100% OK with a Waymo making my trips an extra 5 minutes longer every 50th trip or whatever else the real stat is.

I was curious if Waymo has even been involved with a crash that killed someone, so I looked it up. The answer is yes - there was a Tesla going 98mph in SoMa whose driver died after hitting a Waymo. Clearly the Waymo's fault!

autoexec 22 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

When we learn our lesson that letting companies beta test on public roads consequence free is just another cost to the rest of us so that a small number of people can enrich themselves at our expense.

JumpCrisscross 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> At what point can we be spared from having Waymos lessons inflicted upon us

Again, we had a real event happen. Not hypothetical. What was the actual cost inflicted?

merely-unlikely an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

When humans can cause fewer accidents and fatalities than Waymo on average. People are still inflicting those lessons on us.

s1artibartfast an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

Whenever they become so much a problem that they counterbalance public and private interests in having and improving robotaxis. For most people, we are nowhere near that.

MBCook 8 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> But it's also not a disaster

Because it’s a power outage. If we instead learned about this during a real disaster people could have died because these things were let on the road without planning what they should do in abnormal circumstances.

We’re lucky it’s not a disaster.

SR2Z 16 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

> We’re lucky it’s not a disaster.

I'm sure that if this was something predictable like a cyclone or wildfire, Waymo would still have 100% of their nightly traffic on the road, right? And SFFD would not be able to do what they normally do when they can't get support, which is hop into the car and use the controls to manually move it?

Or... maybe Waymo HAS considered what their cars should do in abnormal circumstances and this kind of outcome was considered acceptable for the number of cars and the nature of the "disaster"?

JumpCrisscross 8 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

> If we instead learned about this during a real disaster people could have died

This is universally true. The question is how bad could it have been, and in which cases would it have been the worst?

> We’re lucky it’s not a disaster

This is always true. Again, the question is how lucky?

We have an opportunity to count blocked emergency vehicles and calculate a hypothetical body count. This lets us characterize the damage. But it also permits constraining hysteria.

gavmor 8 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

No, it's not a disaster, but with a little imagination it could be a hormetic innoculation.

crooked-v 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> They're not.

They are. I did myself yesterday because one was sitting at the front of a turning lane at a dead light, just waiting there forever with the blinker on.

ailurooo 6 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

waymos shouldn't exist, and san francisco shouldn't just be a experimentation lab for tech companies

SoftTalker 8 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

A fire truck can simply push the waymo out of the way.

justin66 7 hours ago | parent | next [-]

It can’t push a block of gridlocked traffic that cannot move because of the dead waymos present out of the way.

SR2Z 15 minutes ago | parent [-]

Unless a few Waymos have gridlocked traffic, I'm not sure you can still blame them for this.

MBCook 8 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

It can do that with a normal driver too. Doesn’t make it ok for there to ever be a situation where they need to when the target vehicle/driver is just fine and capable of doing it themselves.

JumpCrisscross 8 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

> A fire truck can simply push the waymo out of the way

Sure, but it would be notable if one had to. If none had to, we have a problem to solve, not a catastrophe.