A "Manhattan Project" would be building some shocking new technology that didn't previously exist.

If they're cobbling together old parts, it sounds more like something you'd to to keep things running in case a conflict erupts:

> The availability of parts from older ASML machines on secondary markets has allowed China to build a domestic prototype

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darth_avocado 14 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> A "Manhattan Project" would be building some shocking new technology that didn't previously exist.

You’re missing forest for the trees. ASML at the moment has the monopoly on these machines. This is not only a great tool for the West to keep China at bay, but also a way to maintain economic dominance. Even if they can’t get the machine up and running until 2030, and the machine is a generation behind, China has effectively gained leverage in world theater.

From geopolitical perspective, it’s huge. Right now Taiwan produces the world’s chips, so China plays nice. The minute they can produce their own chips, even an older generation, they can invade Taiwan anytime they want. And then the rest of the world won’t even have older chips.

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petcat 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> And then the rest of the world won’t even have older chips.

This basically just means Europe wont have older chips.

TSMC is already producing a significant percentage of their chips in Arizona. And they've even slated ~30% of their total production of 2nm chips and better will be produced in USA by 2028-2029.

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a_wild_dandan 12 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Taiwan’s geopolitical position is vastly more complex than the fantasy where invasion would follow merely from fab parity.

	▲	darth_avocado 11 hours ago \| parent [-]
		It won’t. But again you’re missing the point. It’s one less incentive not to, a big one too.

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13 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

[deleted]

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wood_spirit 19 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

A “manhattan project” can just mean a massive secret scientific war project? Seems apt.

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makeitdouble 12 hours ago | parent | next [-]

They have high security, and obfuscating the premises is part of it, but is it really secret in any way ? I mean, we're knowing exactly what they're aiming for and could compare notes at the end of it.

Is it war ? in a "everything is a war" political sense, perhaps, but not in any other sense.

We're left with "massive project" for the analogy, that's kinda weak really.

	▲	why-o-why 10 hours ago \| parent [-]
		>> is it a war? people love to be reductionist... i wonder what aspects of a culture make everyone so black/white us/them ingroup/outgroup. Is it particular to the US, or like, is France the same way? Or Ghana? Or is it just human that everything is a war? Naqoyqattsi.

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agumonkey 18 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

and a critical nation scale ambition

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why-o-why 10 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

I think the Manhattan Project is a poor analogy. Moonshot is more like it.

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dwroberts 19 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

They are acquiring parts to reverse engineer them and build their own

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exceptione 17 hours ago | parent | next [-]

+ industrial espionage to be able to reverse engineer it at all.

	▲	ux266478 15 hours ago \| parent [-]
		If someone likes you, trade secrets flow like wine. That's basic humanity. It's not unique to China, though the relationships involved are a little bit different. It's not a bad thing either, we all live in the same society.

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nitwit005 18 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

> setting a goal of producing working chips on the prototype by 2028

They might be, but if they plan on getting a factory running in 3 years, they're presumably planning on using what they purchased.

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Qem 14 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> A "Manhattan Project" would be building some shocking new technology that didn't previously exist.

Once they break even they can overshoot into shocking new technology territory.

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ReptileMan 16 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

>A "Manhattan Project" would be building some shocking new technology that didn't previously exist.

I think that both Germany and USSR were not in the least shocked ... just the USA had the resources to finish it.

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why-o-why 10 hours ago | parent [-]

Well, USSR did finish, just 4 years later.

Maybe it was because we had all those immigrants working on it (e.g. Albert Einstein, Hans Bethe, and John von Neumann)!

	▲	tgv 9 hours ago \| parent [-]
		There's a whole regiment of immigrants who worked on the Manhattan project, as we all know. We also know that the USSR obtained much of their knowledge on how to build the bomb through espionage.