People are absolutely somersaulting through hoops to try to make "I don't want to do that" into "I'm going to do it" in the comments lol

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toss1 5 days ago | parent [-]

No, they are accurately observing that the "I don't want to do it" and "feels off mission" statements are FAR weaker than they can be and should be.

Such weak statements are either a real mistake or show movement away from those principles which should be bedrock for Mozilla and towards some justification to abandon those principles.

It's not like the industry has no precedents on this. "Don't Be Evil" was the motto of a company that is now one of the apex predators in the surveillance capitalism ecosystem.

Unwise to try to dismiss and laugh off legitimate alarms.

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glenstein 5 days ago | parent | next [-]

Instead of criticizing an actual contract to engage with a third party or a code push or an affirmative statement, you're attempting to parse a random combination of tea leaves and chicken entrails to indict Mozilla for a hypothetical thing that they explicitly said they're not doing. If that's not scraping the bottom of the barrel, it's only because you're able to imagine an even lower bottom than that that you're willing to reach for.

	▲	toss1 5 days ago \| parent [-]
		>>you're attempting to parse a random combination of tea leaves and chicken entrails It is exactly the opposite — it is reading the actual language used for its intended meaning. Every CEO is expected to not only understand the issues he faces and is managing, but to ALSO carefully choose the words to describe the situation and the intentions of the organization he leads. When a CEO makes a statement about what should be a core fundamental principle of an organization, we can certainly expect that CEO to choose their words carefully. Those words are, or at least should be, the exact opposite of "tea leaves and chicken entrails". If the CEO is sloppy and the chosen words should actually be considered "tea leaves and chicken entrails", that is a different problem of a less-than-competent CEO. If those words were actually chosen carefully, consider these two statements: The actual statement: "[I don't] want to do that. It feels off-mission" A different statement: "This is a core fundamental principle of Mozilla and I will not lead the company in that direction — not on my watch". One could technically say "they both say 'Not today'". But that would be absurd, and stupidly throwing out significant meaning in what the CEO chose to say and how he chose to say it. He made the first vague statement with weasel words instead of something resembling the bold and unambiguous statement resembling the second statement. The statement he did make is "I don't want to", which type of statement has often preceded an eventual "sorry, we had to". There is a lot to make Firefox users nervous, and his choice of statement here did not help matters.

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staticassertion 4 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> It's not like the industry has no precedents on this. "Don't Be Evil" was the motto of a company that is now one of the apex predators in the surveillance capitalism ecosystem.

How is this precedent? "Don't Be Evil" strikes me as extremely explicit. This seems like a counter-example to me.

	▲	toss1 4 days ago \| parent [-]
		Yes. The point is that it started out as a wonderfully explicit and expansive statement. And even THAT explicit and expansive statement was abandoned to the point where the very same company is now a global leader in surveillance capitalism, which is widely considered a massive net-negative for society if not flat-out evil. So, when a CEO won't even make anything more than wish-washy "I don't want to do it" and "feels off mission" statements, people should be concerned that those weak good intentions will hold up even less well.

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jajuuka 5 days ago | parent | prev [-]

This is just tone policing.

"we won't do this" But you didn't say you'd never do this. "okay we'll never do this" But you didn't say you'd never ever do this. "fine we'll never ever do this" But you didn't say that it's never entered your mind once.

They said they won't do it and your interpretation is to demand they said it with more words? Come on, let's stop this nonsense. Can Firefox users ever be happy?