| ▲ | How America's "truck-driver shortage" made the industry a hellscape(freightwaves.com) |
| 24 points by ilamont 4 hours ago | 54 comments |
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| ▲ | tedggh 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] |
| This is becoming a real problem. I spend a good amount of hours driving across states visiting customers and hit few interstates busy with semis. I have seen so many close calls in the last few years and reckless maneuvers that I am now doing some of my work, which includes onsite product demos, remotely, with all the inconvenience and friction that adds in closing a deal. I am also warning family and friends who have long commutes to be extra careful with semis. Keep a good distance, stay out of their blind spots (when passing do it fast don’t drive next to them) and anticipate their actions. I don’t see how we fix this problem other than minimizing our exposure by not driving as much and avoiding busy highways even if that adds time to our commute. |
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| ▲ | A4ET8a8uTh0_v2 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | Chicagoland here. We have a pet theory that covid changed how people drive. From where I sit, it is not just semis ( though those will have the biggest impact should something happen ). That said, just yesterday I was dodging ice balls falling from massive semi ( my only real question was how... was it just getting on the road or something? ) | | |
| ▲ | kingkongjaffa 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | Yes UK Hn'er, here... have observed the same. Covid did a number on people's driving sense. |
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| ▲ | cs702 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Interesting. The OP claims that deregulation efforts from 2016 to 2022, originally meant to address the truck driver shortage, actually led to many minimally trained drivers joining small truck fleets that pay below-market salaries and routinely run 14- to 20-hour days using tampered hardware for logging mileage. These poorly trained drivers, according to the OP, would not pass the vetting of large, compliant carriers. Freight brokers, which now "control" a third of all loads, typically award them to the lowest bidder, pushing spot rates "below the cost of legal operation." The consequences, according to the OP: legitimate carriers are barely breaking even, cargo theft is more prevalent, and roads are less safe. Hmm... maybe? I'm not sure I agree. There's an alternate narrative that is also compelling. Could it be that the rise of freight brokers and the adoption of new technology by small fleets enables them to compete more effectively with large fleets, making this market much more competitive than it ever was? Could it be that shippers now have more viable truck-shipping options at a lower cost, thanks to less opaque freight pricing? Could it be that society as a whole benefits from less expensive truck delivery services? Won't this market, sooner or later, be dominated by self-driving trucks, bringing prices down much further, benefiting society as a whole even more? |
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| ▲ | maratc 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | > enables them to compete more effectively with large fleets, making this market much more competitive than it ever was? Here's an idea: using slaves in coffee and sugar-growing plantations. This will enable slavers to compete more effectively with large non-slave plantations, and the society as a whole would benefit from less expensive coffee and sugar. | | |
| ▲ | cs702 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | Yes, the OP claims many small-fleet drivers are being overworked, but provides zero evidence of it. By evidence, I mean data, not anecdotes. Do you have data on this? --- EDIT: Link to data is at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46173013 It looks like crash rates jumped after the pandemic, then declined in 2022 and 2023, contradicting the OP. | | |
| ▲ | jezzamon 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | The article provide this: "Despite billions spent on safety technology, fatal truck-involved crashes are up ≈40% since 2014" Though I wonder how much that number compares to how much the trucking industry grew in that time. If it grew 200% that would actually mean a big win for safety. Edit: some quick, AI driven research suggests it might've grown 20%. So... Still an issue | | |
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| ▲ | lrem 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Society might care about cost _including externalities_. A truck running on discarded frying oil might offer a lower price and there’s no way to account for the resulting health outcomes. Exceeding capacity lowers unit price and usually doesn’t lead to an accident. Many industries around the world have shown that without functioning enforcement of reasonable rules you immediately get the tragedy of the commons. | | |
| ▲ | cs702 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | I agree. The OP claims that small fleets are cutting costs to extremes that are bad for society, but the OP provides no evidence of it. By evidence, I mean data. Do you have data on this? |
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| ▲ | A4ET8a8uTh0_v2 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | You describe the two states as if those are mutually exclusive somehow. They are not. But that does not answer the real underlying question: is it true? | |
| ▲ | Zigurd 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Or could it be that the tech bros have enabled shifting costs to externalities, like road safety, and the tax funded social safety net keeping underpaid drivers fed? Startup ideas that collect ongoing transaction fees are a hot pattern in investing. The money for those fees has to come from somewhere. Not necessarily a productive somewhere. This sounds like an echo of ride hailing, where people will now pay a bit more to ride a Waymo so they don't have to tell their financially desperate driver that they'll get a bigger tip for calming down a bit. | |
| ▲ | Simulacra 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | I was reading a book recently called "the secret life of groceries" by Benjamin Lorr. He took a ride with truck drivers delivering groceries, and he found that they are terribly abused, underpaid, and that the truck driving schools will literally clean out halfway houses, drug clinics, shelters, anyone they can find who will sign on the dotted line and what is little more than indentured servitude. If anything, deregulation of the trucking industry has had the exact opposite effect. There should be stringent rules on the drivers, but just as equally stringent rules on those that employ and train them. It's a horribly abusive industry, and we should regulate it. |
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| ▲ | i_am_proteus 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| This article appears to have some political bent to it based on comments about immigration. I was made curious about the possibility of an "intentional backdoor" in ELD (Electronic Logging Devices) that allowed truckers to misreport their hours. I was not able to find results to directly confirm or deny that this was true, but it certainly seems like these recently-mandated ELDs come with security concerns:
https://www.ndss-symposium.org/wp-content/uploads/vehiclesec... |
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| ▲ | SonOfKyuss 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | It is odd that they mention several plausible reasons for the problems they see but really seem to single out immigration as the key problem. That seems backwards to me. If safety regulations are no longer being enforced as they claim, where the drivers were born is irrelevant. |
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| ▲ | thunderbong 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| From the article - > These changes were driven by a long-standing belief—pushed hard by the American Trucking Associations (ATA)—that the U.S. faces a permanent truck-driver shortage. The ATA’s solution was to lobby Congress and FMCSA to lower every barrier to entry, convinced that new drivers would flow to large ATA-member fleets rather than small operators. > That assumption was rooted in an old reality: twenty years ago, only the biggest carriers offered real-time tracking, electronic tendering, and direct shipper relationships. Small carriers and brokers were stuck with phone, fax, and leftover freight. > That world no longer exists. Coming from the software industry, I've seen similar things happen when decisions are made which turn out misplaced in the longer term. And I've always wondered - why can't the management respond fast enough to the new scenario? What I've noticed is that as long as the same management team is there which had made that decision, it becomes extremely difficult for them to admit and make that change. Change only happens when either things get really critical, or when the management changes. I wonder whether something similar is involved here. |
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| ▲ | nowaymo6237 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Damn, funny now seeing this when they were blaming immigrants instead of the lax standards due to aggressive lobbying. “Every. Damn. Time” |
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| ▲ | expedition32 3 hours ago | parent [-] | | You can make a job not suck or you can hire immigrants. Guess what happens in capitalism. | | |
| ▲ | gentooflux 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Which economic system makes jobs not suck? | | | |
| ▲ | lo_zamoyski 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | The immigration route only works temporarily, of course: their children will no longer be immigrants and less likely to remain in that business. Hence why relying on immigration to keep replenishing some sector is like having anemia and living off blood transfusions. You’re effectively a vampire. | |
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| ▲ | jraines 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| A relative ran a trucking operation for a few years and now says he’s significantly more wary of any trucks on the road. At the same time, he says that it’s a miserable business because you’re constantly getting sued (at a level markedly higher than the admittedly poor driver performance) |
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| ▲ | meetingthrower 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| We own a towing business focused on heavy recovery. It is true that a huge number of drivers are from eastern europe, and fraud is HEAVY! We take a picture of license, credit card, and the guy with the bill because they all try and scam out of it. |
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| ▲ | sevensor an hour ago | parent [-] | | From the comments on the article, it sounds like regulators have been largely neutralized, and there are lots of shady semi fictitious brokers out there. > As of this morning: > 1,164,093 motor carriers are listed as “Authorized for Hire.” > 107,757 freight brokers are “Authorized for Hire.” > And right now, 206 of them list 30 N Gould Street, Sheridan WY 82801 as their primary address. |
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| ▲ | mrmckizzle 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| My dad retired from truck driving right before the covid lockdowns (2020). The regulations were a massive painpoint. During the Obama's last term they passed in strict time tracking regulations and forced everyone to have GPS trackers on their trucks to enforce the time tracking. Due to this my dad had to drive a higher average speed of ~65-70mph to cover the distances required and not use up his available hours. Before he'd drive slower 55-65 ave mph for longer hours and take frequent breaks. Regulations are fine, but when you make them too strict it makes it difficult for new drivers to join and usually it's easier to be part of a corperation than an owner-operator (my dad). |
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| ▲ | twoodfin 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | This is some relatively neutral contemporary coverage of the Obama regulations: https://www.ttnews.com/articles/teamsters-call-obama-move-fo... The effect you describe of pushing independent drivers into (union?) corporate jobs seems like it was intentional. | |
| ▲ | Zigurd 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | You are drawing a picture of where individual decisions are ineffective in a deregulated environment. Either collective action through a union, or state action through regulation, are needed to induce a safe and sustainable work environment. |
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| ▲ | michaelt 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| > Non-domiciled CDLs introduced, permitting foreign nationals to obtain U.S. commercial licenses In many countries it's common to see freight being driven by foreign drivers simply because that's how cross-border deliveries are done. If a truck of widgets is made in Poland and shipped to a store in Spain, a Polish driver will drive it the whole way. |
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| ▲ | Zak 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| The market response to a labor shortage is to pay people more. It seems as if the industry has taken significant steps to do anything but that. |
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| ▲ | Klaster_1 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| >Freight brokers now control ≈⅓ of all loads and often award them to the lowest bidder, pushing spot rates below the cost of legal operation
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routinely run 14–20-hour days using tampered ELDs. Is the sort of "innovation" you often hear here about when people say "EU can't innovate because of regulations"? |
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| ▲ | Esophagus4 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Tough timing for a condescending "why can't everyone's regulatory regimes just be like the EU" comment: https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2025/12/after-years-controvers... | |
| ▲ | lotsofpulp 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Regulations are only as good as the will of the enforcers. It would be trivial and cheap to use all the technology available today (GPS, broadband mobile networks, high definition cameras, image recognition) to enforce the laws, but the overwhelming political priority is keeping goods cheaper, at the expense of a few more collisions and casualties. | |
| ▲ | oklahomasports 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | We have way fewer third world pedophile rape gangs though. Tradeoffs | | |
| ▲ | n1b0m an hour ago | parent [-] | | and way more high-profile individual ones across politics and finance |
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| ▲ | HPsquared 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| STEM is the same. The expression "fell for the STEM meme" encapsulates it nicely. |
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| ▲ | inglor_cz 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Fairly recently, Bernie Sanders complained in The Guardian about the risk that AI will destroy various jobs, including truck driver jobs. Am I alone in thinking that truck driving is an arduous job that ideally shouldn't be done by humans at all? * long hours and days spent in loneliness, away from family and friends, * possibility to stretch and move your body is very limited, * bad hyper-processed food, hence so many drivers are obese, * the need of humans to sleep and relax means that the trucks cannot legally move for majority of the day, thus there is a need to have more of them, * plus, as mentioned here, both the drivers and their managers are incentivized to break and bend the law, resulting in unsafe driving. All of the above would be mitigated by robots taking the wheel. |
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| ▲ | maratc 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Ideally you would also think about what the truck drivers would do in this new reality where they aren't just unemployed but rather unemployable. Truck driver is the most numerous blue-collar profession in the US, if I remember correctly it counts several million people. I wouldn't expect all of them to become automotive AI model trainers overnight. | |
| ▲ | Simulacra 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | I agree completely, and I think it's only a matter of time until the short haul is completely autonomous. The trucking industry is slowly working themselves out of a job, and it's not just deplorable working conditions, or terrible pay, outright fraudulent schools, or the predatory trucking companies, it's also the rising cost and antipathy towards the very, very very critical role that truckers play in modern society. | |
| ▲ | lo_zamoyski 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Ideally, long-haul freight transportation would be handled by trains and trucks would only be used for last mile deliveries. Ideally. | | |
| ▲ | inglor_cz 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | This is a bit complicated even in Czechia, with its densest network of railways in the world. Trains are most efficient when they are long. 30+ cars, ideally. Capacity of railway lines is limited and lines tend to be shared by passenger traffic as well, so freight mostly moves at night and short freight trains are economically unviable. It might take a long time to gather enough stuff/containers to fill 30 freight cars in one particular railway head (obvious exceptions such as Port of Rotterdam apply). Which means that you may have to wait for 10 days before your shipment actually starts to move. We aren't that patient anymore. |
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| ▲ | hexbin010 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Most of that does not have to be that way. Relentless capitalism and profit maximisation resulted in that. | |
| ▲ | salawat 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | >long hours and days spent in loneliness, away from family and friends Calling bullshit here. If they weren't doing that work, they probably would not, in fact, get extra time with family/friends. >the need of humans to sleep and relax means that the trucks cannot legally move for majority of the day, thus there is a need to have more of them, Team drives can cover a majority of the day if need be for long hauling. Short hauling/last mile is capped not so much by miles traveled, but cargo load and unload times. Folks, get over robotically doing these things. | | |
| ▲ | inglor_cz 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | N == 1, but I used to live in a block of flats with three truck driver families. All three marriages collapsed over their fathers' frequent absence from home. You can say that they would have collapsed over something else if they stayed at home, but this is what the people themselves told me. Driving to Spain and back takes two weeks. After two weeks of his absence "I felt like a young widow already", said Hana, the youngest of the wives. | | |
| ▲ | HappyPanacea 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | > Driving to Spain and back takes two weeks. From Czechia (based on your name)? Why so long? | | |
| ▲ | inglor_cz 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | * Trucks are slower than personal cars. * Pauses are required. * Some roads cannot be used by some vehicles and/or cargo, especially in the Alps. Same with tunnels. * Some countries ban trucks from their roads on certain days and hours, so a day off whether you want it or no. * Sometimes your employer tells you to avoid some extra expensive road even at the cost of longer driving time. (Europe has a myriad of toll systems.) * The cargo for the return journey is usually not ready on the same day, might well take five. |
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| ▲ | clumsysmurf 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| "The Biden-era immigration surge delivered millions of new arrivals seeking work; foreign-owned fleets recruited aggressively—higher pay than at home, no experience needed, free “housing” in the sleeper berth." I was talking to a retired trucker recently. They described a situation where one driver would get the CDL, but shared the cab with 2-3 others (no CDL, maybe family or friends). They would all rotate driving, so at any given time there was a chance the driver actually had no CDL. |
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| ▲ | anovikov 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| It feels like the cry of a yellow cab company operator after Uber came to the town |
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| ▲ | metalman 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| get calls from "shippers" and "logistics", every few days, and notice that the faces and trucks and logo's(or total lack thereof), change just as fast.
The only thing happening is a massive increase in costs.
So more and more I say fuck it, local only, and I do 90% of my own picks and drops, charge the same flat rate for everything I do, which works out just fine and breaks up the routine.nicely.
But the poor basterds doing "piecework" trucking got that maddness in there eye's, got sold on it, and dying trying pull it off.local boys, but people from infinetly bussier and competitive places, just roll with it, and always see the upward oportunity, and move when it's good, and grind harder, when it's not. |
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| ▲ | xpe 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] |
| Has anyone looked at the author’s body of work to get a sense of how they think? What is their analytical toolkit? Professional and personal biases? |