| ▲ | Xenoamorphous 17 hours ago |
| I agree 100% with you. In this niche forum people keep saying “there’s no moat”. But the moat is the brand recognition, if I ask my 70yo mum “have you heard of Gemini/Claude” she’ll reply “the what?”, yet she knows of ChatGPT. Does Coca Cola have a moat? Some company could raise $1B to create a new cola beverage that beats Coca Cola in all blind tests imaginable yet people will keep buying Coca Cola. Did people switch search engines or social networks when Google or FB introduced ads? |
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| ▲ | ysavir 16 hours ago | parent | next [-] |
| I wouldn't call ChatGPT "brand recognition". People know the term ChatGPT, but I don't think they associate it with OpenAI or any company in particular, in the same way that people might associate Civic with Honda. Instead they'll associate it like they do the terms Bandaid, Kleenex, etc., as a catch-all term for LLM chat interfaces, regardless of who is providing the service. When OpenAI starts ads, I imagine people will start saying "oh, here's a ChatGPT without ads" and point to Claud or Gemini or whatever. |
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| ▲ | kibwen 16 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| > But the moat is the brand recognition, if I ask my 70yo mum “have you heard of Gemini/Claude” she’ll reply “the what?”, yet she knows of ChatGPT. Brand recognition doesn't mean a thing when it comes to a technically-illiterate audience with no control over their digital lives. In the same way that every 90s mom called a video game console a "Nintendo", everyone who gets served an LLM-generated response straight from their OS and/or browser courtesy of Google, Apple, or Microsoft will call that a "ChatGPT", and OpenAI will be powerless to stop the platform holders from intercepting their traffic. |
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| ▲ | rco8786 16 hours ago | parent [-] | | Hard disagree. If anything brand recognition is more important for technically illiterate. > In the same way that every 90s mom called a video game console a "Nintendo" And this proves that point. Nintendo sales in the 1990s crushed the competitors numbers. | | |
| ▲ | kibwen 10 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | > Hard disagree. If anything brand recognition is more important for technically illiterate. No, the tech-illiterate gravitate towards the path of least resistance, which just means the platform defaults. OpenAI doesn't control the platform, which means they've already lost to Google, Microsoft, and Apple. Don't build your castle in someone else's kingdom. > And this proves that point. Nintendo sales in the 1990s crushed the competitors numbers. Clearly you know nothing about the history of the console business, because Sony absolutely annihilated Nintendo in the home console market for the decade between 1995 and 2005, despite Nintendo's brand strength. | |
| ▲ | swexbe 16 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | ...and a decade later they were close to bankruptcy. | | |
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| ▲ | dkdcio 17 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| I don’t disagree but want to go on the record predicting this will collapse on itself spectacularly and OpenAI will still “fail” commercially for the Cola Cola drinkers, the product goes from an infallible AI to with no ulterior motives to another Google that’s purpose is to sell you ads, but more creepily. it’s like if Coca Cola started adding a few milliliters of bleach to their product |
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| ▲ | tensegrist 17 hours ago | parent [-] | | normal people don't have the same expectations as you when it comes to how much a given service should know about them, is the thing "how did X know whose profile you saw on Y service" "the computer knows everything i do on the computer, what do you mean" | | |
| ▲ | jon-wood 16 hours ago | parent [-] | | This isn’t backed by the constant conspiracy theories about voice assistants listening to everything you say and then farming that off to third party ad providers so that you see ads for things you’ve been discussing. | | |
| ▲ | solumunus 16 hours ago | parent [-] | | People moan about that but it doesn’t change their consumer habits at all. | | |
| ▲ | cgriswald 16 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | I’m not certain about that, but it’s all very abstract to people. It is also tied to their phones for most people which they’d never give up anyway. The more direct connection on something they don’t (yet) value as much as they value their phones might be a bridge too far. An LLM feels like a person to a lot of people. It might be surprisingly difficult to avoid people feeling betrayed or creeped out by this “person”. No one has ever done this before and it doesn’t seem easy or like a straightforward win. | |
| ▲ | Aurornis 5 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | I think most people know it’s not actually true. It is odd how often I hear even technically people defend the idea that Instagram is listening to everything they say even while the phone is locked, sending it to Meta, and then influencing their ad delivery. You have to either have very little understanding of mobile apps and reverse engineering to believe that this is happening but nobody has been able to find proof yet. It’s right up there with people who believe conspiracies about everyday things like chemtrails. If you really though chemtrails were disbursing toxic mind control chemicals (or whatever they’re supposed to be this week) then you’d be going to great lengths to breathe only purified air and relocate to another location with fewer flight paths. Yet the chemtrail conspiracy theorists don’t change their behavior. They just like complaining and being angry, and it’s something they can bond with other angry complainers about. |
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| ▲ | macNchz 16 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| I think it’s more reasonable to consider Coca Cola as having a significant brand value moat, given that they’re 140 years old and one of the most recognizable brands in the world. That also gets at the other side of their moat: distribution. Coca Cola is available basically everywhere, and a challenger would have to invest massively to simply get in front of as many people on shelves. In that way, other companies (Google, Microsoft, Meta) still have significant legs up on OpenAI. Way too much in play right now to declare any winners. |
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| ▲ | Xenoamorphous 11 hours ago | parent [-] | | Who cares if it took 140 or 3 years to get brand recognition. ChatGPT is also everywhere if you have an Internet connection. | | |
| ▲ | macNchz 5 hours ago | parent [-] | | There’s a difference between something that has existed for a few years that lots of people have heard of, and something that people have been buying their entire lives, and that their grandparents also bought for their entire lives. As to distribution—the internet certainly makes it logistically easier to get your product to consumers, but an infinitely large store shelf still means you’re competing for consumer attention, and the big players already have that attention for their existing successful products. |
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| ▲ | mattlondon 16 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Don't ask them if they know the model name, ask them if they've used the ai mode in Google search or their phone or Gmail or whatever. "Oh yeah I use that all the time!" is what they usually say to me. People say ChatGPT has brand recognition but amongst non-students and non-tech in the UK I don't think it is that pervasive at least. |
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| ▲ | cheschire 17 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Related: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poppi_(drink) |
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| ▲ | 16 hours ago | parent | prev [-] |
| [deleted] |
