Remix.run Logo
SllX 9 hours ago

Right now there is no non-violent path to achieving that because Taiwan intends to violently and militarily resist if it comes to that. Probably with the aid of America, although I’m a lot less certain of that than 5 year ago, and it’s looking like it’s a lot more likely to be with the aid of Japan as well.

Also a success by the PRC would still result in the political destruction of the Republic of China and the subjugation of its people.

noduerme 8 hours ago | parent | next [-]

It should be noted that even if Taiwan's military resistance were negligible (or on the order of Tibet's), which it's not, that would not validate invading them and taking away their autonomy. For all intents and purposes, Taiwan is a self-governing nation, distinct from China precisely because it does not wish to be part of China.

SllX 6 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Agreed.

MangoToupe 8 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Taiwan is not distinct from China. Both the ROC and the PRC view Taiwan as part of China (ironically, at the cost of the mass slaughter of taiwanese to in service of the chinese).

decimalenough 7 hours ago | parent | next [-]

"One China" is a political fig leaf that allows both sides to pretend the other country doesn't exist.

Back in reality, the Republic of China (Taiwan) is fully independent from the People's Republic of China and fulfills every criteria of nationhood.

MangoToupe 4 hours ago | parent [-]

Ok, nothing you said contradicts anything I said

noduerme 7 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

From that perspective, the ROC is the legitimate government of Beijing.

Facts on the ground appear otherwise, but facts on the ground also imply that Taiwan is not part of the PRC's version of China.

MangoToupe 4 hours ago | parent [-]

> From that perspective, the ROC is the legitimate government of Beijing.

No. I don't understand how you came to this conclusion. Both governments claim legitimacy and only one has actual sovereignty.

SllX 3 hours ago | parent [-]

In practice, they are both sovereign over separate territories.

MangoToupe 8 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> Taiwan intends to violently and militarily resist if it comes to that

I sincerely wonder if the people who live there agree. I sure as hell wouldn't put up much fight if china tried to invade my country; just the opposite. If anything I wonder if voluntary unification is on the table in today's climate

n4r9 7 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> I sincerely wonder if the people who live there agree ... I wonder if voluntary unification is on the table

One of the benefits of a free democratic society is that you can ask; and people vote according to their preferences. A recent study suggests ~13% of the public support unification with China: https://www.tpof.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/02/20250214-TPO... . Taiwan's politics are dominated by the KMT and DPP parties, both of which oppose unification.

> I sure as hell wouldn't put up much fight if china tried to invade my country

Perhaps you have an unusual opinion?

noduerme 7 hours ago | parent | next [-]

>> Perhaps you have an unusual opinion?

That or a remarkably flexible sense of morality, coupled with a supine nature and a total lack of balls.

MangoToupe 4 hours ago | parent [-]

Let's not pretend it's ever moral to support the state you live under. You should support yourself and bide whatever state imposes itself on you.

MangoToupe 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

> Perhaps you have an unusual opinion?

I live in the US. I think it's pretty obvious the PRC is more competent in every way than our own government is.

And from what I've seen of the ROC parliament, it is also an embarrassment to their own people

haspok 4 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> I live in the US. I think it's pretty obvious the PRC is more competent in every way than our own government is.

Yes, and you wouldn't be able to express your political opinion (like you do here on HN or anywhere else) if you were living in China. People living in the US tend to overlook that minute detail.

mitthrowaway2 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I'm willing to concede that the CCP may be more competent than the US government, but the Taiwanese government (despite their antics in parliament) ranks alongside Singapore and Norway in my top three most competent governments in the world. That's purely my own subjective opinion of course but I see no reason for the Taiwanese people to be embarrassed.

n4r9 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

If you live in the US, supporting a Chinese invasion is definitely unusual.

> the PRC is more competent in every way

I guess it depends what you mean by competent. Dictatorships can be frightfully competent at certain things, but that doesn't make them a good place to be. We're talking about a country that is genociding its own Uyghur ethnic group, represses Tibetan culture, disappears its own elite athletes, and has a horrific LGBTI record. The US is far from perfect, but has nothing on China in terms of nastiness.

That's not even touching the biggest problem of dictatorship, which is what happens when Dear Leader takes a fall. I doubt Xi has much more than a decade of leadership in him, and I worry for the Chinese populace when he goes.

noduerme 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Unification, in this case, means surrendering all rights to privacy, all rights to free expression, everything.

The fact that you wouldn't fight being occupied and forced to be a slave doesn't speak highly of you, but I must admit it's an honest statement, and it's true that a lot of people might feel the same way. A majority of people everywhere are cowards, collaborators and sycophants. But they're along for the ride.

Now, if your country is Burma, I don't blame you.

MangoToupe 4 hours ago | parent [-]

> rights to privacy, all rights to free expression, everything.

Surely rights to more substantial things like healthcare make this quite an easy decision. Freedom to criticize a government doesn't matter if you can't force the government to actually give a shit about anything

deltaburnt 3 hours ago | parent [-]

Does Taiwan not have healthcare? Verbatim from Wikipedia:

> According to the Numbeo Health Care Index in 2025, Taiwan has the best healthcare system in the world, scoring 86.5 out of 100,[6] a slight increase from 86 the previous year.[7] This marked the seventh consecutive year that Taiwan has ranked first in the Numbeo Health Care Index.[8]

somerandomqaguy 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Just my sense as an outsider, but a lot of interest in voluntary reunification got chilled after seeing China's actions in Hong Kong. A lot of it stems from lack of trust for the CCP to honor it's idea of a one county two systems form of governence.

I don't know how much the Taiwanese would be willing to fight and die in a military invasion though.

Lio 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> I sure as hell wouldn't put up much fight if china tried to invade my country; just the opposite.

Realy? What is your country and why would you prefer to live under a dictatorship?

breve 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

What is your country? China is always looking for more territory. If you've got water and mineral resources, all the better.

fragmede 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Fascinating! Why not? Why would you just lay down and let someone else rule over you?

noduerme 6 hours ago | parent [-]

In terms of survival strategies, letting someone else rule over you was sort of the OG Christian thing before they got control of the Roman Empire. It's kind of the default in most places. Declaring independence and actually succeeding at it and governing yourself is remarkably rare. The question isn't what you think is wise, or what you would do (because no one knows until they're in that situation). It's whether you feel you have anything worth preserving when you are conquered. Some people don't, evidently. Other people do.

dmpk2k 6 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> Some people don't, evidently. Other people do.

I like how this can be interpreted two ways, depending on whether you place loved ones above governance, or vice versa.

thworp 5 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

You simply cannot compare the experience of being conquered in a pre-modern society to being conquered by the PRC.

Premodern States simply couldn't afford the level of oppression and exploitation that is possible today. They usually just replaced the upper layers of the old hierarchy, put some small garrisons in a few places and left most local elites in charge, often with their local armies. If there was an organized rebellion, there would usually be a a few skirmishes and then a re-negotiation of the terms.

Today even Morocco could afford to turn Western Sahara into a territory with total surveillance, checkpoints everywhere and an impenetrable wall in the desert while slowly ethnically cleansing the native population.

YouAreMammon 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

The tankies are out in full force tonight.

aurareturn 8 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

  because Taiwan intends to violently and militarily resist if it comes to that
I doubt Taiwan truly wants to do this. It has more to do with the US wanting to use Taiwan as a pawn to contain China's power.
noduerme 7 hours ago | parent [-]

If you lived in a country with local political representation and free elections, would you want your children to grow up in slavery to a dictatorship across the sea? Ask the Irish.

aurareturn 6 hours ago | parent [-]

China has already said they'd allow one country two systems.

brigandish 6 hours ago | parent | next [-]

How’s that going in Hong Kong?

MangoCoffee 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

LOL. is this a joke? Hong Kong?