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logankilpatrick 5 hours ago

First off, apologies for the bad first impression, the team is pushing super hard to make sure it is easy to access these models.

- On permission issue, not sure I follow the flow that got you there, pls email me more details if you are able too and happy to debug: Lkilpatrick@google.com

- On overall friction for billing: we are working on a new billing experience built right into AI Studio that will make it super easy to add a CC and go build. This will also come along with things like hard billing caps and such. The expected ETA for global rollout is January!

brandon272 5 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Just a note that your HN bio says "Developer Relations @OpenAI"

Zenst 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Sure it will get updated to same as Linkedin - Helping developers build with AI at Google DeepMind.

Imagine many on here have out of date bio's and best part - it don't matter, but sure can make some funnies at times.

jvolkman 2 hours ago | parent [-]

Just search the r/bard or r/geminiai subreddits for Logan. He's very famously a Google employee these days.

osn9363739 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I was interested. I does look like he just needs to update that. His personal blog says google, and ex-openAI. But I do feel like I have my tin foil on every time I come to HN now.

roflyear 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Pretty funny! I wonder how much of a premium Google is paying.

ukuina an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Congrats on the move to Google!

Please allow me to rant to someone who can actually do something about this.

Vertex AI has been a nightmare to simply sign up, link a credit card, and start using Claude Sonnet (now available on Vertex AI).

The sheer number of steps required for this (failed) user journey is dizzying:

* AI Studio, get API key

* AI Studio, link payment method: Auto-creates GCP property, which is nice

* Punts to GCP to actually create the payment method and link to GCP property

* Try to use API key in Claude Code; need to find model name

* Look around to find actual model name, discover it is only deployed on some regions, thankfully, the property was created on the correct region

* Specify the new endpoint and API key, Claude Code throws API permissions errors

* Search around Vertex and find two different places where the model must be provisioned for the account

* Need to fill out a form to get approval to use Claude models on GCP

* Try Claude Code again, fails with API quota errors

* Check Vertex to find out the default quota for Sonnet 4.5 is 0 TPM (why is this a reasonable default?)

* Apply for quota increase to 10k tokens/minute (seemingly requires manual review)

* Get rejection email with no reasoning

* Apply for quota increase to 1 token/minute

* Get rejection email with no reasoning

* Give up

Then I went to Anthropic's own site, here's what that user journey looks like:

* console.anthropic.com, get API key

* Link credit card

* Launch Claude Code, specify API key

* Success

I don't think this is even a preferential thing with Claude Code, since the API key is working happily in OpenCode as well.

Wolf_Larsen 19 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Hi, is your team planning on adding a spending cap? Last I tried, there was no reasonable way to do this. It keeps me away from your platform because runaway inference is a real risk for any app that calls LLMs programatically.

vessenes 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Oh man, there is so, so much pain here. Random example - if GOOGLE_GENAI_USE_VERTEXAI=true in your environment, woe betide you if you're trying to use gemini cli with an API key. Error messages don't match up with actual problems, you'll be told to log in using the cli auth for google, then you'll be told your API keys have no access.. It's just a huge mess. I still don't really know if I'm using a vertex API key or a non-vertex one, and I don't want to touch anything since I somehow got things running..

Anyway vai com dios, I know that there's a fundamental level of complexity deploying at google, and deploying globally, but it's just really hard compared to some competitors. Sadly, because the gemini series is excellent!

everdev 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Maybe the team should push hard before releasing the product instead of after to make it work.

asah 4 hours ago | parent | next [-]

But then we'd complain about Google being a slow moving dinosaur.

"Move fast and break things" cuts both ways !

(ex-Google tech lead, who took down the Google.com homepage... twice!)

bayarearefugee 4 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Its not a new problem though, and its not just billing. The UI across Gemini just generally sucks (across AI Studio and the chat interfaces) and there's lots of annoying failure cases where Gemini will just timeout and stop working entirely midrequest.

Been like this for quite a while, well before Gemini 3.

So far I continue to put up with it because I find the model to be the best commercial option for my usage, but its amazing how bad modern Google is at just basic web app UX and infrastructure when they were the gold standard for such for like, arguably decades prior.

risyachka 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

We are talking here about the most basic things- nothing AI related. Basic billing. The fact that it is not working says a lot about the future of the product and company culture in general (obviously they are not product-oriented)

lxgr 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Imagining the counterfactual (“typical, the most polished part of this service is the payment screen!”), it seems hard to win here.

harles 5 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

That’s a pretty uncharitable take. Given the scale of their recent launches and amount of compute to make them work, it seems incredibly smooth. Edge cases always arise, and all the company/teams can really do is be responsive - which is exactly why I see happening.

recursive 4 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Why should the scale of their recent launches be a given? Who is requiring this release schedule?

rishabhaiover 4 hours ago | parent [-]

the market

recursive 3 hours ago | parent [-]

If it's a strategic decision, then its impacts should be weighed in full. Not just the positives.

windexh8er 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

We're talking about Google right? You think they need a level of charity for a launch? I've read it all at this point.

mantenpanther 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

The new releases this week baited me into business ultra subscription. Sadly it’s totally useless for gemini 3 cli and now also nano banana does not work. Just wow.

GenerWork 4 hours ago | parent [-]

I bought a Pro subscription (or the lowest tier paid plan, whatever it's called), and the fact that I had to fill out a Google Form in order to request access to get Gemini 3 CLI is an absolute joke. I'm not even a developer, I'm a UX guy who just likes playing around with seeing how models deal with importing Figma screens and turn them into a working website. Their customer experience is shockingly awful, worse than OpenAI and Anthropic.

xmprt 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Please make sure that the new billing experience has support for billing limits and prepaid balance (to avoid unexpected charges)!

sandworm101 4 hours ago | parent [-]

Lol. Since the GirlsGoneWild people pioneered the concept of automatically-recurring subscriptions, unexpected charges and difficult-to-cancel billing is the game. The best customer is always the one that pays but never uses the service ... and ideally has forgotten or lost access to the email address they used when signing up.

mrandish 2 hours ago | parent [-]

> or lost access to the email address they used when signing up.

Since Gmail controls access to tens of millions of people's email, I'm seeing potential for some cross-team synergy here!

Workaccount2 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

The fact that your team is worrying about billing is...worrying. You guys should just be focused on the product (which I love, thanks!)

Google has serious fragmentation problems, and really it seems like someone else with high rank should be enforcing (and have a team dedicated to) a centralized frictionless billing system for customers to use.

luke-stanley 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I had the same reaction as them many months ago, the Google Cloud and Vertex AI stuff namespacing is a too messy. The different paths people might take to learning and trying to use the good new models needs properly mapping out and fixing so that the UX makes sense and actually works as they expect.

mattchew 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I had pretty much written off ever my credit card to Google, but a better billing experience and hard billing caps might change that.

phatfish 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

[flagged]