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| ▲ | crazygringo 3 hours ago | parent | next [-] |
| The big dogs absolutely do phase config rollouts as a general rule. There are still two weaknesses: 1) Some configs are inherently global and cannot be phased. There's only one place to set them. E.g. if you run a webapp, this would be configs for the load balancer as opposed to configs for each webserver 2) Some configs have a cascading effect -- even though a config is applied to 1% of servers, it affects the other servers they interact with, and a bad thing spreads across the entire network |
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| ▲ | creatonez 26 minutes ago | parent [-] | | > Some configs are inherently global and cannot be phased This is also why "it is always DNS". It's not that DNS itself is particularly unreliable, but rather that it is the one area where you can really screw up a whole system by running a single command, even if everything else is insanely redundant. | | |
| ▲ | __turbobrew__ 10 minutes ago | parent [-] | | I don’t believe that there is anything necessarily which requires DNS configs to be global. You can shard your service behind multiple names: my-service-1.example.com my-service-2.example.com my-service-3.example.com
… Then you can create smoke tests which hit each phase of the DNS and if you start getting errors you stop the rollout of the service. |
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| ▲ | siegecraft 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| I think it's uncharitable to jump to the conclusion that just because there was a config-based outage they don't do phased config rollouts. And even more uncharitable to compare them to crowdstrike. |
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| ▲ | __turbobrew__ 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | I have read several cloudflare postmortems and my confidence in their systems is pretty low. They used to run their entire control plane out of a single datacenter which is amateur hour for a tech company that has over $60 billion in market cap. I also don’t understand how it is uncharitable to compare them to crowdstrike as both companies run critical systems that affect a large number of people’s lives, and both companies seem to have outages at a similar rate (if anything, cloudflare breaks more often than crowdstrike). | |
| ▲ | cyberpunk 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | It seem fairly logical to me? If a config change causes services to crash then rollout stops … at least in every phased rollout system i’ve ever built… |
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| ▲ | JohnMakin 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| In a company I am no longer with I argued much the same when we rolled out "global CI/CD" on IAC. You made one change, committed and pushed, wham it's on 40+ server clusters globally. I hated it. The principal was enamored with it, "cattle not pets" and all that, but the result was things slowed down considerably because anyone working with it became so terrified of making big changes. |
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| ▲ | wbl 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Then you get customer visible delays. |
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| ▲ | immibis an hour ago | parent | prev [-] |
| Because adversaries adapt quickly, they have a system that deploys their counter-adversary bits quickly without phasing - no matter whether they call them code or configs. See also: Crowdstrike. |
