We need 50 mile PHEVs more than anything. I think there's two decades of these while EV economies of scale and charging infrastructure builds out.

Basically, you design a skateboard EV, but way less batteries and you put a recharge engine instead of the frunk. So I don't even think it would be a major departure from the current generation of EV engineering.

I think this can challenge a new price point until sodium ion batteries hit their stride and really change the economics of EVs.

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bryanlarsen 2 days ago | parent [-]

So take out about $2000 worth of batteries and add $10000 worth of engine, transmission and other complexities to lower the price?

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linotype 2 days ago | parent [-]

Don’t worry, when they release 50 mile range PHEVs they’ll just move the goalpost to 100 mile range. It’s like hydrogen, meant to maintain the status quo vs zero emission (via solar, hydro, wind and nuclear).

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tzs 2 days ago | parent [-]

I believe 50 miles is commonly chosen because something like 70% of non-rural drivers drive less than 50 miles per day. With a 50 mile PHEV and level 1 charging at home at least half of non-rural drivers would be able to operate most of the time in EV mode.

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bryanlarsen 2 days ago | parent [-]

Hybrid vehicles are an artifact of the CAFE regulations. Manufacturers subsidized them to meet their CAFE quotas. CAFE has been neutered, so their premium over pure gasoline vehicles will go up significantly.

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AtlasBarfed a day ago | parent [-]

I live in rural areas and drive a Phev. It's piddly 15 mile range sucks and I would love one that does 50. I would be all electric except for long distance, which I do 500 mile trips frequently with poor recharging infrastructure.

I am not some shill for the oil company.

EVs are a huge pain in the ass out here. EV range is a big fat lie as well 400 miles, but it degrades 10%, but you only charged to 90%. If you use AC heat lose another 15% range, 10-20mph permaheadwind out of the west? Another 10%. Choppy stress cracks? Another 5%.

If phevs has been pushed more we would have maximized battery supply to the most electrification of daily miles driven, and they still can.

A recharge engine doesn't need transmissions, gearboxes, and can be smaller and run Atkinson cycle.

The US government continues to botch charging infrastructure, incentives, domestic battery production, etc. Phevs can pave over a great desk of that.

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bryanlarsen a day ago | parent [-]

Would you be willing to pay $10,000 over a gasoline vehicle for a 50 mile PHEV?

Certainly there are some people that are. It's the intersection of people in situations like yours and those who are willing to pay to do their part for the environment. But that's a pretty small set of people. A large minority of people are in the first bracket and a small minority in the second bracket. The intersected set is pretty small.

With incentives like CAFE reducing that $10,000 number the market was much larger.

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AtlasBarfed a day ago | parent [-]

Huh, funny, is that how much a PHEV costs relative to an EV?

No?

Because a PHEV is basically the same as an EV, except you take 4/5s of the battery out (and make four more PHEVs from that supply).

THEN, you put a nice compact rotary engine that runs at one optimized speed and an alternator. Does that sound like it costs $10,000? Does your lawnmower cost $10,000?

"It's a pretty small set of people" Dude, you live in on the West Coast, it is so blindingly obvious. There's about, what, 40 states between the two coasts? Right, NOBODY lives there.

	▲	bryanlarsen a day ago \| parent [-]
		> No? No, relative to a gasoline car. Reread my comment. > "It's a pretty small set of people" Second time you misread my comment. I said a "large minority" of people are in your situation. IOW, slightly less than half the population. But how many people are in your situation AND are willing to pay a significant premium for PHEV? That's the small set. I drive an electric in Saskatchewan, which is likely far more hostile to electric than wherever you live. Most people there won't spend $3000 extra for a PHEV vs a gasoline car, let alone significantly more than that.