totally respect your choice, and it's a great project too. Of course as a maintainer of Ollama, my preference is to win you over with Ollama. If it doesn't meet your needs, it's okay. We are more energized than ever to keep improving Ollama. Hopefully one day we will win you back.

Ollama does not use llama.cpp anymore; we do still keep it and occasionally update it to remain compatible for older models for when we used it. The team is great, we just have features we want to build, and want to implement the models directly in Ollama. (We do use GGML and ask partners to help it. This is a project that also powers llama.cpp and is maintained by that same team)

Fully compatible is a stretch, it's important we dont fall into a celebrity "my guy is perfect" trap. They implement a few endpoints.

I won't use `ollama` on principle. I use `llama-cli` and `llama-server` if I'm not linking `ggml`/`gguf` directly. It's like, two extra commands to use the one by the genius that wrote it and not the one that the guys just jacked it.

The models are on HuggingFace and downloading them is `uvx huggingface-cli`, the `GGUF` quants were `TheBloke` (with a grant from pmarca IIRC) for ages and now everyone does them (`unsloth` does a bunch of them).

Maybe I've got it twisted, but it seems to be that the people who actually do `ggml` aren't happy about it, and I've got their back on this.

It’s unfortunate that llama.cpp’s code is a mess. It’s impossible to make any meaningful contributions to it.

Interesting, admittedly, I am slowly getting to the point, where ollama's defaults get a little restrictive. If the setup is not too onerous, I would not mind trying. Where did you start?

Isn't the open-webui maintainer heavily against MCP support and tool calling?

First, I must say I appreciate you taking the time to be engaged on this thread and responding to so many of us.

What I'm referring to is a broader pattern that I (and several) others have been seeing. Of the top of my head: not crediting llama.cpp previously, still not crediting llama.cpp now and saying you are using your own inference engine when you are still using ggml and the core of what Georgi made, most importantly why even create your own version - is it not better for the community to just contribute to llama.cpp?, making your own propreitary model storage platform disallowing using weights with other local engines requiring people to duplicate downloads and more.

I dont know how to regard these other than being largely motivated out of self interest.

I think what Jeff and you have built have been enormously helpful to us - Ollama is how I got started running models locally and have enjoyed using it for years now. For that, I think you guys should be paid millions. But what I fear is going to happen is you guys will go the way of the current dogma of capturing users (at least in mindshare) and then continually squeezing more. I would love to be wrong, but I am not going to stick around to find out as its risk I cannot take.

Everyone just wants to solarpunk this up.

They can’t keep getting away with this.

What? The obvious move is to never have switched to Ollama and just use Llama.cpp directly, which I've been doing for years. Llama.cpp was created first, is the foundation for this product, and is actually open source.

There are many, many FOSS apps that use Ollama as a dependency. If Ollama rugs, then all those projects suffer.

Its a tale we seen played out many times. Redis is the most recent example.