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zug_zug 5 days ago

I see a lot of people say "writing is so important," and I think what they mean is "I feel really smart/good when I write." And I think what they are experiencing is that they've been assembling ideas in their heads for weeks, and only when it's all come together are they ready synthesize that information at a higher level, and they mistake this synthesis for the writing itself (rather than the writing being a symptom OF the synthesis -- if they had tried to write a week prior they would have found it unproductive).

__rito__ 5 days ago | parent | next [-]

This is not true for at least me.

Let's say, I am making something concrete by putting ideas, thoughts, knowledge into paper. While doing it, I am finding gaps and mistakes and finding opportunities to correct them. But it is not limited to 'correction', it also opens newer dimensions and perspectives- ones that previously didn't exist in my conscious mind.

I consider writing as a tool of thinking. Another tool is brainstorming with a group, or any group discussion in general. These amend to your thoughts, make the existing ones more solid, and opens new direction, and unravels connections previously not accessible.

Read this essay by Paul Graham: Putting Ideas into Words [0]. And also refer to his other essays on writing.

There is also a great book by Paul Zissner: Writing to Learn. I suggest this book to people.

Writing, when done while learning works akin to teaching- one of the most crucial steps in so-called Feynman Technique of learning.

[0]: https://paulgraham.com/words.html

FrankenDino 4 days ago | parent | next [-]

Anything by William Zinsser is worth reading.

https://www.goodreads.com/author/show/7881675.William_Zinsse...

zug_zug 5 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Yeah I think I've read multiple PG essays on the importance of writing, but they always struck me as no different than Katy Perry telling you to sing, or some Grandmaster saying "go play chess." That is -- a personal anecdote that doesn't necessarily generalize.

I'm not saying that writing can't be a useful tool to organize ideas, definitely it can. But I think I've found two things:

- Now the best way to "iterate" my thoughts is to rubberduck with ChatGPT; it's really amazing how much faster I can learn when I admit how little I know, even on something like global warming or an advanced math topic.

- By and large, "organizing my thoughts" isn't really a high-return activity in my life. Having an intelligently written blog that I've put hundreds of hours into has never done anything for my career or led to any personal connections, and honestly who's to say my time wouldn't have been better-spent just coming with some jokes to network better rather than having some cohesive theory of everything that nobody asked for?

__rito__ a day ago | parent | prev [-]

I just noticed that I wrote William Zissner's name wrong. Please read 'Paul Zissner' as William Zissner.

jryb 5 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Just one personal anecdote: I definitely find contradictions or gaps in my thinking/knowledge when I write. Finding and resolving those deficiencies is what I point to when I say "writing is thinking".

denkmoon 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Getting stuff written down makes me realise the weak points and the errors in my thinking which I know from experience I don't find if I don't write it down.

bGl2YW5j 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

This is a really cynical take. People work differently and get value from different things. It’s probably safe to assume most aren’t virtue signalling about writing.

sorcerer-mar 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I disagree. Not sure how common this workflow is, but I write by putting all the different unsynthesized ideas down and rearrange them as the latent structure "reveals itself." At the end you have something synthesized.

Sure some type latent structure was there all along (thus why I put them down), but it wasn't necessarily visible to me, nor optimal, nor did it include/exclude all the right points. The need for iteration itself proves that the act of writing is actually doing the synthesis.

aquariusDue 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Sometimes I like to test whether I can actually construct or assemble a finished something in my mind from an inkling of a thought.

For example a few days ago I realized that I found it hard to reverse a word in my mind, even a simple one. Try for yourself, think of a word and then reverse it in your head with your eyes closed.

Some people might struggle with the above, some may find it doable in their heads, but most can agree that it's absurdly easy if you can externalize it to paper or a text editor at least.

chambers 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I think you're right. I'll add on: there's a lot of thinking that does not need writing, and there's a lot of writing that needs no thinking. Deng Xiaoping and other greats wrote pretty minimally for their own thinking, if at all. Whereas many of us not-so-greats seem to knee-jerk comment without a single thought.

It makes sense for our age. Amid a thousand distractions, typing on the keyboard gives the illusion of getting a grip. Note-taking on my computer gives the illusion of a second brain. Ululating on the internet gives the illusion of sharing thoughts.

Instead of "writing is thinking", I prefer "thought precedes speech" https://inframethodology.cbs.dk/?p=1127; it fits the small human mind better though I've yet to learn it properly.

wrp 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

You need to add into consideration that laying things out in visual display provides cognitive support, reducing the effort to reason about more things. So writing out ideas really does allow you to reach a greater scope of synthesis.

lukebechtel 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

it depends how you write.

often when I write an idea down, my "inner critic" process gets more activated upon seeing the textual representation.

thus I find gaps and flaws more easily.

not true for all domains, but many.

jimbokun 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

If they tried writing a week prior that would have realized sooner the gaps in the ideas they were assembling, leading to them closing those gaps faster.

starluz 2 days ago | parent | prev [-]

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