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mark_l_watson 5 hours ago

A liberal Israeli friend has told me on a few occasions that Iran is one of the safest places in the Middle East for Christians and Jews to live, work, and raise families as long as they don’t publicly protest against the Iranian government.

I have no way of knowing if my friend is correct about this, but with the conflicting news broadcasts in the USA the situation is as confusing as hell. Off topic, but I have started finding news shows on the Internet from different countries like Singapore to try to figure out some semblance of truth about the world.

bearjaws 4 hours ago | parent | next [-]

That is an absurd take.

Your friend's statement, that religious minorities in Iran are safe as long as they don't protest, is basically like a situation of domestic abuse.

An abuser might claim their partner is free and happy, as long as they follow the rules and don't speak out. The home may appear peaceful to outsiders, but this "peace" is maintained through fear, control, and the constant threat of violence for any perceived transgression.

hkpack 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> The home may appear peaceful to outsiders, but this "peace" is maintained through fear, control, and the constant threat of violence for any perceived transgression

Isn’t it exactly like the present day USA? Where ethnic minorities can be taken out by masked militia and disappear in a concentration camp without any due process for any reason?

bearjaws an hour ago | parent | next [-]

You know who Kilmar Armando Ábrego García because America is still quite far from being Iran.

I can't tell if you are even serious to draw the comparison, if you get disappeared in Iran there is literally nothing to help you.

prh8 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Yes, it is, but HN is about as toxic red as Blind, just masked by lots of technical arrogance

kyrra 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Can you give some context here? You are saying something pretty wild.

Eextra953 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Look up the situation in Los Angeles, where a mix of ICE agents and masked unmarked men are targeting Hispanic neighborhoods and taking anyone they believe isn't a citizen (brown). There's been several cases of citizens being taken and detained for weeks. Recently, there's been videos of these men roaming in cars with license plates removed. These men refuse to identify themselves. Its an extremely alarming situation which has, at least in my feeds, not received nearly enough attention.

righthand 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

No it’s not: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Detention_of_Mahmoud_Khalil

shepherdjerred 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

I think they're referring to ICE

saagarjha 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

To extend this admittedly awful analogy domestic abuse can be preferable to being murdered.

beepbooptheory 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

As opposed to what though? Serious protests are always met with threats of violence. We had snipers pointed at us just the other day as we marched over here in the USA. I have seen, in person, reporters beaten, passerbys bleeding out on the street, I've had my entire neighborhood bombed with gas...

Perhaps you have a point but it can only be one of degree! Or perhaps we can try to think of a single state that does not maintain itself through violence?

nivertech 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> Iran is one of the safest places in the Middle East for Christians and Jews to live, work, and raise families

It is only somewhat safe for token minorities, tiny pockets of remaining Jews, native Christians: Armenians and Assyrians, but not Parsis (Persians who escaped Islamization) or Mandeans (an ancient gnostic sect)

Non-native Christians (i.e. Iranians who converted to Christianity) are severely persecuted. Same for various heterodox sects / offshoots of Islam like Baháʼís, Ismailis, Ahmadis, Yazidis, Shabakis, Yarasanis, etc.

Large non-token minorities (like Azeris, Kurds, Balochi, Arabs) are persecuted. Non Shias are unable to get a government jobs. According to some demographic estimations Persians per se are a minority in Iran, which would make it an apartheid state

Gays are forced to undergo gender reassignment surgeries

Women …

> A liberal *Israeli* friend told me several times that Iran ____

Thinking critically, what makes your so-called "liberal" Israeli friend an authority on Iran? Are they a recent Jewish immigrant from Iran? Do they speak Farsi? Are they an academic researching Iran? Do they serve in military intelligence or the Mossad (or not-Mossad)?

tim333 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I travelled in Iran a bit. I'd say it's pretty safe as long as you don't protest the government or contradict their religious views. My mum is a Bahai and deals with quite a lot of Iranian Bahais who get imprisoned, killed etc for believing in the wrong version of god. Bahaism is kind of an offshoot of islam and are generally more tolerant and less violent so they get killed as heretics by the lovely islamists.

EvgeniyZh 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Iran has official discrimination against both ethnic and religious minorities.

On the other hand, Jews had to leave the Muslim countries both in Northern Africa and the Middle East, with the total Jewish population there shrinking from hundreds of thousands to hundreds. Compared to that, Iran, from which only 70-90% of Jews left, looks not that bad. However, there were testimonies that members of Jewish families aren't allowed to leave the country all together, so I'm not sure if everyone is staying there at will.

gspencley 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

One way to get some insight into this is to look at the demographic break down of Iran pre and post 1979 revolution.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Iran#Religious...

Pre-1979, per the 1976 census, Iran had a Jewish population of 62,258 (0.2%). Post-revolution it immediately fell to ~9k, where it has remained - at least until the last census in 2016 (0.0% representation).

While Christian representation didn't decline by the same amount, it took a sharp decline as well. Pre revolution (1976) saw a Christian representation of around 0.5%. 30 years later (2006 census) it was 0.2%.

What conclusions you should draw from that are open to interpretation... and when it comes to life in the Middle East and North Africa, you can also draw relative comparisons (is Iran worse or better for these groups?). But it's usually not a good sign when the population of an ethic or religious minority takes a sharp and sudden decline.

throw310822 4 hours ago | parent [-]

In the case of the Jewish population, Israel is relatively close, with a comparatively higher standard of living and free entry, and there is a strong incentive for Jews to emigrate there even in the absence of hostility or outside pressure.

nivertech 4 hours ago | parent [-]

It’s not close - Israel is an island, you can’t drive or fly from Iran to Israel … yet

The Iranian Jews had to immigrate via another countries, I guess via Europe. Also boys had first to serve in the army to earn right to travel outside Iranian borders

frollogaston an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

As with most religious minorities in the Mid East, this protection is conditional and can also go away on its own at any time. Same kinda goes for Israel but at least it's more stable.

mathgradthrow 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

it seems to be a pretty safe place to be mossad.

foobarian 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> one of the safest places in the Middle East

Added emphasis

gosub100 42 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

as long as they dont get raped, or refuse to wear their hijab

bamboozled 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

As long they’re not women who don’t want to cover their head in rags , they’ll be fine ?