| ▲ | kumarvvr 15 hours ago |
| If Iran has nukes, then a nuke race will start in the middle East, especially with Saudis, who will want their own nukes. Iran getting nukes is the spark that will start a lot of chain reactions. And islamic populations are radicalized enough that the possibility of a nuke on Israel increases dramatically. |
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| ▲ | selcuka 14 hours ago | parent | next [-] |
| > If Iran has nukes, then a nuke race will start in the middle East A fair concern, but it is interesting that although "estimates of Israel's stockpile range between 90 and 400 nuclear warheads" [1], we are not concerned about those warheads as much as we do about the ones Iran might have. Should US bomb Israeli nuclear plants? No. Should they have bombed the Iranian ones? Why? [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_weapons_and_Israel |
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| ▲ | buzzerbetrayed 13 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Maybe it has something to do with Israel being an ally and Iran sponsoring terrorism all over the region | |
| ▲ | partiallypro 12 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | We didn't want Israel to have nukes either, we tried to stop them and failed. We wouldn't bomb Israel's nukes because they -already- have them, and they have grown in a semi-reliable regional ally since then. We are trying to stop Iran from having them at all to prevent them from being essentially off-limits to retaliation (note Iran is the #1 state sponsor of terrorism / people's fears of supporting Ukraine given Russia keeps threatening nuclear action) and kicking off a regional nuclear arms race. | |
| ▲ | yonisto 14 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | [flagged] | | |
| ▲ | heavyset_go 13 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | > Death to Arabs is an anti-Arab slogan originating in Israel. It is often used during protests and civil disturbances across Israel, the West Bank, and to a lesser extent, the Gaza Strip. Depending on the person's temperament, it may specifically be an expression of anti-Palestinianism or otherwise a broader expression anti-Arab sentiment, which includes non-Palestinian Arabs. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_to_Arabs | | | |
| ▲ | all_factz 13 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Have you been to Israel? I have cousins there. When I was 14 and visited, my 19 year old cousin told me we need to kill all the Arabs because “if we exile them, they will just come back.” Do you really think (a large segment of) Israelis are less crazy than (a large segment of) Iranians? | |
| ▲ | vFunct 14 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Israel has always threatened its neighbors. Remember, it was born as a group of European Jews that attacked Palestine to conquer their land, with arms provided to them by Europe. It will always exist under a state of war. We have to let Israel die off and change our alliances. An alliance with Iran would be much more beneficial to America than an alliance with Israel. | | |
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| ▲ | danenania 15 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| I think this attack makes it more likely they’ll get nukes, not less. They moved all their enriched uranium already, and now they know that there’s no longer any point in diplomacy. The next facilities they build will be a few times deeper, and I have no doubt we’ll soon be hearing that ground troops are the only way to stop them. |
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| ▲ | dlubarov 14 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | They had already crossed the line into nuclear tech that's specifically for weapons, i.e. with a 400kg stockpile of uranium enriched to 60%. Unless we accept explanations like "scientific curiosity", they were already somewhere in the process of building nuclear weapons, even if success wasn't immanent. I don't know how long these operations will set them back, but if the Iranian regime won't willingly refrain from nuclear weapons work, isn't a delay better than nothing? | | |
| ▲ | jjk166 13 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | 60% enrichment is not weapons grade. Weapons grade is 80%. High enrichment is used in certain reactor designs, such as naval reactors. There are a lot of reasons to be enriching uranium besides building nuclear weapons. Considering the US reneged on its deal to drop sanctions in exchange for Iran to not enrich uranium, it is pretty obviously useful as a bargaining chip, in the negotiations. The US intelligence community assessed that Iran has not been working on a bomb since the program was shut down in 2003. They didn't want a nuke, they wanted an end to sanctions. They further wanted to avoid provoking exactly this sort of conflict. This did not delay them getting nuclear weapons, it will make them get nuclear weapons. | | |
| ▲ | dlubarov 12 hours ago | parent [-] | | To quote an ISIS report, "Iran has no civilian use or justification for its production of 60 percent enriched uranium, particularly at the level of hundreds of kilograms". In theory it could be for naval propulsion, but experts (including IAEA inspectors) seem unconvinced. | | |
| ▲ | jjk166 12 hours ago | parent [-] | | They had a very obvious use for it: trade it to the US in exchange for sanctions relief. |
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| ▲ | danenania 14 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | They “could have” had nuclear weapons for a long time if they’d wanted to, yes, but they didn’t get them. They signed the NPT, allowed inspections, and their ruler issued a fatwa against developing nuclear weapons. Why’d they do all that if their goal all along was to get a nuclear weapon? They could have just done it. These attacks make it clear that they would have been better off if they had gotten them, so it seems reasonable to assume this will be their new policy. What other strategic choice have they been left with? | | |
| ▲ | dlubarov 14 hours ago | parent [-] | | Just to clarify, is your position that Iran was never working toward nuclear weapons, or just not until recently? I think enriching uranium to 60% is pretty clear evidence of their intent, even though it's just one component of an eventual weapon. Being an NPT signatory could be evidence of Iran not working toward nuclear weapons, if they were compliant. But they have violated their NPT obligations on some occasions, with major violations recently. | | |
| ▲ | danenania 13 hours ago | parent [-] | | I think they wanted to be seen as credibly close as a deterrent and bargaining chip in negotiations, but they had no intention of going all the way unless attacked. Now they likely do intend to get them asap if they’re able to. |
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| ▲ | mupuff1234 15 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Those can be bombed right at the beginning. Israel will probably try to establish a similar status que as in Lebanon right now - "if you make a move we immediately take it out". And the development of a nuclear sites leaves a significant intelligence trail, not sure it can be hidden. (Of course they can always be gifted a bomb, but that's a very different story) | | |
| ▲ | danenania 15 hours ago | parent [-] | | Yeah I’m sure it will be a huge success with no unforeseen consequences whatsoever. Since that’s how these things have been going over the last thirty years. | | |
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| ▲ | nashashmi 15 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Islamic populations? |
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| ▲ | kumarvvr 14 hours ago | parent [-] | | Most of Islamic republics are fiefdoms, kingdoms and dictatorships. Most of the populations are radicalized, and have very limited freedom of speech and right to protest. | | |
| ▲ | Ar-Curunir 14 hours ago | parent [-] | | Have you lived in any of these Islamic countries? | | |
| ▲ | booleandilemma 14 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | You just have to read a wikipedia article on them. No need to live there. | |
| ▲ | kumarvvr 14 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Is that a pre-condition to know about countries, leaderships and general public? I have not lived in the US, and I know a lot about the US national character. | | |
| ▲ | Ar-Curunir 12 hours ago | parent [-] | | Yes, I would say that making sweeping statements about a populace does require actual first-hand experience with said populace. |
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| ▲ | jenny91 14 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Almost a kind of domino theory, if you will? |
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| ▲ | vFunct 14 hours ago | parent | prev [-] |
| And that's something we will have to accept, that Islamic populations will always have nukes. How do you plan to handle a world with Islamic populations having nukes? Because that's something you will have to plan for. You have no choice. They will not let you not let them have nukes. They will make sure they will have nukes. That's just given. |
