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ecshafer 5 days ago

There are a couple fundamental flaws here:

One is that the number one Science and Engineering powerhouse prior to WWII was Germany, not Britain.

Two this totally neglects that the US received the lion's share of Scientists and Mathematicians from countries like Germany, Hungary, Poland etc with the encroachment of the Soviets and persecution of the Jewish people.

While the down up approach of the US and heavy funding probably helped a lot. Bringing in the Von Neumanns and Erdos of the world couldn't have hurt.

dataviz1000 5 days ago | parent | next [-]

This started when George Washington went to the Jews in Newport, Rhode Island to speak to them promoting the 2nd of the 12 amendments to the Constitution, 10 of which became the Bill of Rights. Rhode Island was the last state to ratify the Constitution and this trip was to garner support to ratify the Bill of Rights which was to safeguard individual freedoms and limit the power of the federal government. Many of the Jews who first arrived in the United States did so in New Amsterdam whose families had pervious settled in Amsterdam after the Spanish Inquisition where they were forced to either leave Spain, convert to Catholicism, or be put to death.

Reiterating what the Hebrew congregation write to Washington he responded:

> For happily the Government of the United States, which gives to bigotry no sanction, to persecution no assistance requires only that they who live under its protection should demean themselves as good citizens, in giving it on all occasions their effectual support. [0]

It is a paradox that people living the United States with its freedoms can only continue doing so as long as they equally protect the freedoms of everyone else without bigotry or persecution.

[0] https://founders.archives.gov/documents/Washington/05-06-02-...

reubenswartz 5 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Unfortunately, the German example is quite relevant these days. We seem intent on destroying the leading system of research universities in the world... ;-(

marcosdumay 4 days ago | parent | next [-]

Yep, some of the first things Hitler did when he took power was to reverse the ridiculous large brain drain from most of the world into Germany, and stall most research by the chilling effect of censoring random topics and fighting institutions that harbored people he didn't like.

bamboozled 5 days ago | parent | prev [-]

Smart people are annoying and told us to wear masks though ?

yabitts 5 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

[dead]

blululu 5 days ago | parent | prev [-]

Prior to WWII the United States was the world's leading power in terms of Science, Engineering and Industry - not Germany or the British Empire. The reason that Central European scientists fled to America (and not Britain) is because the United States had the scientific, engineering and industrial base to absorb them. Consider some of the major scientific breakthroughs to come out of the US leading up to and coming out of the war: Nylon, Teflon, Synthetic Rubber, Penicillin, Solid State Transistors, Microwave Communication, Information Theory, a Vaccine for Polio... These all would have happened with or without the war and the migration of German scientists (though adding John von Neumann to the mix probably helped move things along).

boxed 5 days ago | parent | next [-]

> Prior to WWII the United States was the world's leading power in terms of Science, Engineering and Industry - not Germany or the British Empire

Per capita? The US had a larger population.

blululu 4 days ago | parent [-]

Being the leading power is about magnitude not intensity. The country that is twice as large and operates at a similar level of intensity will be the more dominant force (see also - China today). Per capita, I would bet on the Swiss (then and now) - though it will depend on the metric at that point and their output will be comparable to the Germans, British, French and the Americans.

JetSetWilly 4 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> Penicillin

Invented and developed in the UK.

> Microwave communication

Lion's share of pre-war advances and development were in various European countries.

> Synthetic Rubber

Developed by Fritz hoffman at the Bayer Laboratory in Germany, 1906

Frankly, your comment is a massive self-own.

sinuhe69 4 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Prior WW 2, the US had even no notion of quantum physics. How could it be the world power in science?

blululu 4 days ago | parent | next [-]

The US definitely had a notion of quantum physics prior to WWII. Feynman got his PhD at Princeton in 1942 in Quantum Physics so I would assume that John Wheeler had some familiarity with the topic back then. I would mention that the most significant result of quantum mechanics is solid state transistors, and Shockley was awarded a phd for quantum mechanical applications back in the 30s.

Dumblydorr 4 days ago | parent | prev [-]

Michelson and his experiments on the aether not existing were enormously influential to theoretical physics. “No notion” is incorrect, they had numerous home grown talents in physics, on top of the huge influx of talent from 1930s immigration of European scientists.

The USA being a beacon of hope and enlightenment in those days stands in stark contrast to the isolationist, anti-intellectual, anti-research, and frankly xenophobic policies pursued by the current admin, courts, and congress.

timeon 4 days ago | parent | prev [-]

Someone was reading too much of Mobi Dick.