Some regulations are good. Like the ones regulating drugs and gambling (that have been largely dismantled).

But we don't need the government to protect people from Facebook!

throw10920 10 months ago | parent | next [-]

I would say that it depends on the exact details of regulation being discussed, not just the target.

For instance, you could propose a regulation that says that any type of gambling with any wager, whether using real currency or fictional, for any age range, should be illegal. I think most people would consider that to be unreasonable.

You could also propose a regulation that says that companies cannot collect personal data on individuals for advertising purposes unless that individual is directly engaged with that company as a customer. This would hopefully render illegal Facebook's "shadow profiles"[1] that collect data on non-customers. While more controversial, I'd say that this would still be supported by most people you'd meet, while still falling into the category of "the government protecting people from Facebook".

Details of regulation matter, a lot.

[1] https://www.howtogeek.com/768652/what-are-facebook-shadow-pr...

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10 months ago | parent | prev | next [-]

[deleted]

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afavour 10 months ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Why don’t we? Cigarettes are harmful to people, they get regulated. If Facebook is harmful, why not regulate it?

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slibhb 10 months ago | parent [-]

So you really not see a difference between _lung cancer_ and "my teenager is moody"?

The evidence that Facebook harms people is extremely iffy.

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afavour 10 months ago | parent | next [-]

Do you not see the difference between “my teenager is moody” and “depression”? Using minimizing language here helps no one.

I agree that there should be more formal research into the effects of social media but as a parent I see concern about the effects of social media in conversation with other parents and teachers all the time. It is something we all witness in our own lives to some extent or another.

“We should let this run rampant while we investigate it fully” and “we should block this while we investigate it fully” are both valid viewpoints. And if voters want the latter it only makes sense for the government to be responsive to that.

	▲	slibhb 10 months ago \| parent [-]
		It's very hard, maybe impossible, to answer the question of whether social media harms people. It's like asking if TV, video games, etc harm people. Maybe -- but I don't trust the studies and at any rate, these are things people should decide for themselves and their families.

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BSDobelix 10 months ago | parent | prev [-]

>The evidence that Facebook harms people is extremely iffy.

Funny because internal documents at Facebook said exactly that about teenagers:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2021/09/16/faceboo...

https://fairplayforkids.org/facebook-research-children/

https://theconversation.com/states-sue-meta-for-knowingly-hu...

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hn_acker 10 months ago | parent [-]

Facebook's internal documents showed that on 11 of 12 body image issues, Facebook was helpful to more teens than it was harmful to [1]:

> For example, lots of people rely on the reporting around the Frances Haugen leaks from inside Facebook to argue that “Facebook knew” that Instagram causes “body image issues” for children (and then most people leapt to the belief that the company then ignored and downplayed that finding). But, as we noted, the actual study told a very, very different story. As we pointed out at the time, the study was an attempt to do the right thing and understand if social media like Facebook was actually causing negative self-images among teenagers, and the study found that for the most part, the answer was absolutely not.

> It looked at 12 different potential issues, and surveyed teenaged boys and girls, and found that in 23 out of 24 categories, social media had little to no negative impact, and quite frequently a mostly positive impact. The only issue where the “negative impact” outweighed the “positive impact” was on “body image issues” for teenaged girls, and even then it was less than one-third of the teen girls who said that it made it worse for them. And the whole point of the study was to find out what areas were problematic, and which areas could be improved upon. But, again, in every other area, “made it better” far outranked “made it worse.”

[1] https://www.techdirt.com/2022/11/28/contrary-to-popular-opin...

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BSDobelix 10 months ago | parent [-]

Written by Mike Masnick.....

Next, face filters are actually good for teenage self-esteem, just don't put mirrors in your house, or onlyfans... where women find the real mental glowup.

	▲	hn_acker 10 months ago \| parent [-]
		> Next, face filters are actually good for teenage self-esteem, just don't put mirrors in your house, or onlyfans... where women find the real mental glowup. Did anyone suggest anything close to that? And why mention OnlyFans? If the number of teen users helped by a social media site with face filters is greater than the number of teen users harmed by the social media site, then the former group might already be avoiding or using the worse features (including but not limited to face filters) in a healthy way. Parents and guardians should be teaching children to use the internet in a healthy way, including by warning that photos on social media can be edited with internal and external tools. Some public schools include the topic of manipulated images on social media in health class. Removing face filters from social media sites that have them might be a good idea, but people with severe body image issues will resort to external tools and post the edited images in their group chats. But I digress. Of the pressures that teen social media users attribute to social media, "overwhelmed because of all the drama" and "like their friends are leaving them out of things" are more prevalent than "worse about their own life" [2]; even then, most teen social media users report that social media makes them feel "more connected to what's going on in their friends' lives" and "like they have people who can support them through tough times" [3]. The percentage of teen social media users reporting that social media has had a net positive effect on them personally is greater than the percentage that report a net negative effect [3] (and the sample probably includes users of TikTok and Instagram, which have face filters). > Written by Mike Masnick..... Wherein he links to [4] the publicized results [5] of Facebook's internal research, provides a major infographic from the results, and follows up with infographics and excerpts from Pew Research, yes. Also, I have to correct what I wrote in my previous comment. What I originally wrote: > Facebook's internal documents showed that on 11 of 12 body image issues, Facebook was helpful to more teens than it was harmful to The evidence I referred to was from public documents about internal research, not internal documents. The infographic was about Instagram, not Facebook. Instagram, which has an app with face filters. The reesearch was about 12 issues, of which one was body image. The corrected version of what I wrote is: < Facebook's public documents on an internal study showed that on 11 of 12 issues (including problematic use, social comparison, and eating issues), Instagram was helpful to more teen users than it was harmful to. The 12th issue was body image. Instagram was helpful to more teen boys than it was harmful to, but more harmful to teen girls than it was helpful to. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42266581 [2] https://www.pewresearch.org/internet/2022/11/16/connection-c... [3] https://www.pewresearch.org/internet/2022/11/16/connection-c... [4] https://www.techdirt.com/2022/11/28/contrary-to-popular-opin... [5] https://about.fb.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/09/Instagram-Te...

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meiraleal 10 months ago | parent | prev | next [-]

We definitely do. Just enforcing the laws would do, as drugs and gambling is a good amount of social media ads revenue

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lm28469 10 months ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> But we don't need the government to protect people from Facebook!

Says who exactly ?

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lcnPylGDnU4H9OF 10 months ago | parent | prev [-]

Why gambling but not Facebook?

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slibhb 10 months ago | parent | next [-]

Among other things, there is solid evidence that the move toward gambling in the US has been a disaster. This is a topic that's fairly easy to study in objective terms.

The evidence for social media harming people is highly disputed and, I would say, largely unconvincing. For one thing, it relies on self-reported subjective well-being.

	▲	blargey 10 months ago \| parent \| next [-]
		I'm not sure how you define "harm", but I think a reduction in "self-reported subjective well-being" is one of the more robust definitions.
	▲	Der_Einzige 10 months ago \| parent \| prev [-]
		Sports gambling is nothing compared to Dave and busters or Chuck E. Cheese’s tickets. We hook our kids of disgusting gambling behavior (legally?). No one cares about this and wants to go after sports betters instead. God damn boot lickers all over this thread. I’m so glad to not live anywhere near that godforsaken island.

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zknow 10 months ago | parent | prev [-]

Isn't gambling usually illegal for minors?