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tomcam 16 hours ago

Of course we can motivate ourselves. But they're acting like we did in the 1800s through the mid 1900s. They just build anywhere no matter what. They have no interest in dealing with environmental concerns. The officially released pollution levels in China are mind-boggling and they still do not represent how bad it really is.

You think US manufacturers wouldn't be delighted to just buy a few hundred acres land and start building stuff? They'd do it in a heartbeat. For better and for worse, it is not a level playing field. Conforming to government regulations over here is stifling for a 100-house development in Arkansas, but it's almost impossible in California, Illinois, or New York. Now imagine what it's like to build a huge factory. It is nearly impossible to get permission, and inspections, endangered wildlife concerns, waste removal, etc. handled in under 5-10 years.

Aperocky 13 hours ago | parent | next [-]

The air quality in China is lot better now than a decade ago. The smog was so bad in 2012 and I remembered the AQI hitting 999 (the max it would go) on more than one occasions during Beijing winter.

Went back again in early 2024 and it was so much better, pollution still noticeable on more days than not but at least half the time I spent had AQI below 100.

aurareturn 10 hours ago | parent [-]

I was in Shenzhen in 2017 and again recently. The difference is huge. The air quality walking around the street is very good and you never smell gasoline.

underwater 11 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I’d argue that vested interests in oil and coal have done more to damage the US’s ability to invest like this than any regulatory red tape.

Huge parts of America hate EVs. There is endless debate about nuclear vs clean energy vs coal, which prevents any change from happening.

robwwilliams 15 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Counterpoint: See the speed with which Colossus has been (is being) assembled in Memphis Tennessee. Yes, on an existing industrial site but this is still one damn impressive accomplishment.

https://www.servethehome.com/inside-100000-nvidia-gpu-xai-co...

HeatrayEnjoyer 14 hours ago | parent | next [-]

A data center is much easier than building an industrial factory

inemesitaffia 7 hours ago | parent | next [-]

They had to build themselves because third parties gave longer timelines.

throwaway2037 11 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

This seems like an apples to oranges comparison. They are completely different. Can you provide some specific examples?

tomcam 13 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Is it your thought that is typical for large-scale development?

buran77 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> Conforming to government regulations over here is stifling for a 100-house development in Arkansas, but it's almost impossible in California, Illinois, or New York. Now imagine what it's like to build a huge factory. It is nearly impossible to get permission, and inspections, endangered wildlife concerns, waste removal, etc. handled in under 5-10 years

Reading this (and I completely agree, it's even worse in Europe), sounds like Chinese "management" implemented Agile on a whole new scale.

The upside of a planned economy is that it can work like the internals of a private company, with one drive, "do what needs to be done". The downside is that it can work like the internals of a private company where you bite the bullet or look for another employer. This is much harder with countries, especially because planned economies are more likely to have taller fences around them.

matthewdgreen an hour ago | parent [-]

The flipside of this argument is that it enables Chinese industrial interests to operate on strategies with 10+ year time scales, whereas Western markets seem to focus on the next few quarters. This is probably very efficient for some businesses, but not for big industrial corporations with long development timelines.

Dalewyn 15 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

This is why Trump has pushed for mass deregulating, America (let alone the west) can't compete against China when our politicians demand that we straight up don't.

cmrdporcupine 2 hours ago | parent [-]

So we compete with a highly regulated planned economy by getting rid of regulations?

Gotcha.