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Aurornis 2 hours ago

This always sounded intuitively correct to me, but looking back over the past two decades basically all of the successful entrepreneurs and business owners I know didn’t come from families with a lot of resources and didn’t have much of a safety net. They just went all in on their goals when they were young and had many years ahead of them to start over if it all went wrong.

Contrast this with some of the people I grew up who came from wealthy families: A lot of their parents pushed them toward entrepreneurship and funded their ventures, but to date I can only think of one business from this cluster of friends that went anywhere. When you come from such resources and wealth that you don’t need to succeed and you can drop the business as soon as it becomes difficult, it’s a different situation.

I don’t know exactly what to make of this, other than to remind myself to keep pushing through the difficult times for things I really want even when I could fall back to an easy path and give up.

an0malous 29 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

Who are you thinking of? Bezos, Zuckerberg, Gates, Musk all came from wealthy families. They all had the safety net of their family wealth if their business didn’t work out. Even someone who had parents to pay their student loans is relatively privileged, not everyone starts their 20’s debt-free and able to take financial risks.

enaaem an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

There is also survivor bias at play here.

Succeeding without safety net is hard -> only the best can do it -> the best entrepreneurs you know did not had a safety net

Normal_gaussian 44 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I've seen quite a few of these funded entrepreneur-lifestyle kids now; I've worked (briefly) with many of their companies. Many of them are making enough of a real go at it such that I can't tell them from others, but quite a few don't know enough about how a default alive business works and deliver a DoA even when the core idea or a short pivot works and has traction - these guys need so much better PMF to succeed.

The best businesses I've seen parents find for their children are lettings agents (urgh) and basic manufacturing (last mile door assembly etc.). You can get the business model in a six month course, the staff are minimum wage, the product is high margin. If your parents buy the building you are so close to default alive its a joke. Grow the business, flip it, and try the big idea.

jbs789 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

If you don’t have a fall back, you have no choice but to make it work.

wat10000 9 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

Cortez burning^Wscuttling his ships.

JustExAWS an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

Or fail miserably…

fragmede an hour ago | parent | next [-]

Which we don't hear about. Except maybe via GoFundMe.

bbarnett an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

You know what?

Peter used to say, that every successful company could look back at a defining moment early on, where they would have died had it not been for the courage, and the tenacity, and maybe the insanity of one visionary person who put it all on the line, even though it seemed like a huge mistake at the time.

A moment where all the metrics and the numbers didn't mean anything.

It was all about the emotion. It was about belief, rational or irrational.

And I think...

I hope that I just witnessed that.

raw_anon_1111 38 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

On the other hand, no matter what you do, you can’t invest like Warren Buffett.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/adamhartung/2014/11/19/why-you-...

The whole idea of succeeding by “grit” makes way too many people too idealistic and unrealistic.

Don’t get me wrong, Peter Drucker (hopefully that’s the Peter you are referring to) had some great actionable advice. But believing in yourself and have grit is about as banal as “thoughts and prayers”

toss1 33 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

You know what? This is indeed where courage, tenacity, and risk-taking make a difference.

But what makes the difference in whether or not we hear about it is pure luck and survivor bias.

If their luck was just right that with all that push in the right time the deal came through or the product sold, then we hear about what a great success it was, and how important was their grit.

And many smart determined people with all the courage, tenacity, and risk-taking in the world have also taken the big risk, but dice did not roll their way, or the hill was just so steep it didn't work, so we hear nothing of them. And their number likely vastly exceeds the few for whom it did work.

konaraddi an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> looking back over the past two decades basically all of the successful entrepreneurs and business owners I know didn’t come from families with a lot of resources and didn’t have much of a safety net

There’s probably some truthyness to this but it doesn’t account for survivorship bias. And there’s a baseline amount of resources necessary to take a risk and be able to try again (e.g., good luck taking a risk when preoccupied by [lack of] health, housing, food).

wat10000 11 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I’d expect it to stratify based on the kind of business.

Typical small businesses (plumbing, HVAC, restaurants, convenience stores) I’d expect to come from poorer families. These businesses are a potential avenue to success without traditional credentials, and they’re not the sort of thing somebody is likely to start as a passion.

From wealthy families, I’d expect vanity businesses. There wouldn’t be as much motivation for the annoying aspects of a real business. And anyone who is interested in business can probably get a nice start in something their family owns or has a major stake in.

Moonshot companies I’d expect to come from the upper middle class, children of doctors and such. Not fabulously wealthy, so the potential for making millions can still be a big motivator. But comfortable enough to get advanced schooling and be willing to aim big with a chance of failure, rather than going for something mundane you know is always in demand, like fixing pipes.

Off the top of my head, Gates, Page, and Zuckerberg all fit that mold.

hooverd 39 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Well, how many non-successful entrepreneurs and business owners do you know?

zmmmmm 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

you can extend that to all Silicon Valley and the US in general.

It has one of the weakest social security systems. Not even proper healthcare is guaranteed. Yet it out innovates all of Europe, Canada, Australia, other places that have incredible social "safety nets".

I agree with the other commenter: safety nets and multiple tries are always good to have, but persistence and grit are even more important, and these come more from necessity.

exceptione an hour ago | parent | next [-]

> Yet it out innovates all of Europe, Canada, Australia, other places that have incredible social "safety nets".

Probability: highly unlikely.

Speaking for Europe, I see a lot of silent innovation. No press, no LinkedIn posts, not an article on their website. There are a lot of US firms that shop in Europe for high tech. (I know of instances were the US company buys the IP from the EU supplier + take public credit for it + forbids the supplier for showcasing their success in public.)

What is different is:

1) the amount of money available in the US. The US enjoyed a very beneficial position post-WOII, enabling them to run high deficits.

2) the US has a positive attitude to entrepreneurship. You are not a failure when your company goes bankrupt, you learn from it and you go-go-go.

enaaem an hour ago | parent | next [-]

Also the EU lacks a unified capital market where infinite VC money can be pooled together into any new hype. I would argue this the biggest reason.

lanfeust6 22 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

Productivity is lacking in those other countries. That said, I don't think it has to do with safety net, which is not much different in the U.S.

raw_anon_1111 an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

You can have all of the “grit” you want to and still fail. You just never hear about the failures.

lordnacho an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Most of the US graduates have their degree and a network to fall back on. It's nice to have actual money in the bank, but it can also be acceptable to have a high chance of getting a rewarding job if the moonshot doesn't work.

In other words, human capital.

Most of the entrepreneurs I meet are not going to be homeless if things don't work out. They'll be employed.

raw_anon_1111 an hour ago | parent [-]

Exactly this many also have parents who can help subsidize them, stay on their parents health insurance until they are 26 and worse case move back home. This isn’t just the privilege rich, this can also be your mid to mid upper income couple who can help their kids out.

lordnacho an hour ago | parent [-]

Yep, and most of these fallbacks are insurance-like: you can always say you never asked your parents for anything. Like me. Thing worked out, so I didn't need their money. But if they hadn't, I would have a place to sleep and eat.

bequanna 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

> Not even proper healthcare is guaranteed.

…except it is. Health insurance is available on a sliding scale based on income and essentially free for most low income people.

agf an hour ago | parent | next [-]

In some areas and for some people, Medicaid probably does count as proper healthcare. But it certainly doesn't for other people / other places. Imagine there being one doctor within a multi-million person metro area who takes Medicaid for some sub-specialty. 90 minutes away from you by car. And you don't have a car. This is the reality for millions of Medicaid recipients, including ones I know personally in Chicago.

raw_anon_1111 21 minutes ago | parent [-]

Not Medicaid, subsidized ACA. I know a lot of young healthy people that just take the chance of not having health care. Worse case you can’t squeeze blood out of a turnip if you have to go the emergency room.

I don’t think my older (step)son has had insurance since he got off our plan at 26 over two years ago.

nradov an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

Sure, although in some areas healthcare is effectively unavailable to Medicaid plan members because providers have stopped accepting those patients. Being insured doesn't mean much if you can't schedule an appointment.

https://www.wsj.com/health/healthcare/medicaid-insurers-doct...

moralestapia 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Every single western "entrepreneur" who starts making a little more than 100k/year likes to tell itself this story.

Did you have any (real, not GenZ) mental or physical disability?

Did you have a house to come back to every day? Did you have a hot meal waiting for you whenever you wanted?

Did you have a community that supported you through your business?

Did you have a legal structure around you that allowed you not to worry about getting kidnapped/killed? A structure that enforces getting paid after you've earned your money?

98% of what you have was given.

I do agree, however, that a lot of people don't even bother to put in the remaining 2%.

raw_anon_1111 18 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

What’s even funnier when I hear that my thought is “congratulations I guess??”. They are now making less than an average mid level developer doing CRUD enterprise dev 3 years out of school in any major metro area in the US.

That’s not even considering that the intern I mentored in 2021 is now making in the low $200s as an SA at BigTech at 25.

cadamsdotcom 42 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

“Can you start a business without $10m of family capital” is a societal question.

“Can you start a business on an empty stomach without a roof over your head” is not the same debate. A roof over your head is a prerequisite to almost everything else in life - starting a business is WAY down the list. Better to have societies work to provide food and roofs - which they do, with varying degrees of success.

moralestapia 14 minutes ago | parent [-]

It is the exact same debate.

People without those things cannot play the lottery as many times as those who have them. They might not even get to play it once.

If everyone around you has all of those basic human needs met, you are the exception.

But of course people don't like to hear this, because their whole meritocracy myth (which has always been trash) comes falling down and they might be forced to admit that, please excuse me for making this outrageous statement, ... you're just an average person with slightly better luck than others.

(It is true, however, that "luck" compounds through your life and even more through generations, though. But that even detracts from the meritocracy myth even more, as the family you're born in greatly defines what you'll achieve.)

LPisGood an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

All of those things are great and should be afforded to every Person. In many places, they are.